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Modern Sunrise Primer


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ishocrone



Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 112

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:02 am    Post subject: Modern Sunrise Primer Reply with quote

Introduction :

Spoiler: Welcome to the most complicated combo deck in the modern format! Or atleast the longest, ha. The deck has an interesting history, which is recounted in the history section of the primer. So, what is this "eggs"? The eggs moniker for this deck came from it's origins in the use of the Odyssey "eggs" like Sungrass Egg, Skyshroud Egg, and Darkwater Egg. The deck has since lost these invaluable staples as they rotated out in extended, and are two blocks too early for Modern. With the creation of the modern format though, there is now a new testing ground for this decks viability, as much of the extended tech ports over quite nicely. The recent bannings actually help this deck quite a bit, since it was unscathed by the loss of those cards while control and then storm combo took the brunt of that power shift. The way I see it, it's time to crack a few eggs!


How the Deck Plays :

Spoiler:
Setup
Hardcast "eggs" aka: chromatic stars, chromatic spheres, conjurer's bauble, and elsewhere flask during the first few turns to get an amount of "draw" on the board. If you have any lotus blooms in your opening seven, suspend them. Then on the turn you go off or the turn before you go off, reshape one of the artifacts into a lotus bloom if you can.

Combo
crack your ghost quarters, lotus blooms, and any fetchlands you have (like misty rainforests) and then strain the mana through your eggs. Those eggs are used to fix your mana and dig deeper into the deck to find more pieces. Then fire off second sunrise to return them all to the battlefield. You then use the draw from your eggs to dig for a second sunrise or noxious revival, while adding any other eggs you find along the way to the board. Eventually, you'll be able to get down to the last few cards of the deck.

Kill
Conjurer's bauble takes a card from your graveyard and puts it on the bottom of your library, and afterwards it draws a card from the top of your library. With zero cards in your library, you can sac it to put any card in your graveyard into your hand. You target a used second sunrise which goes to your hand, while the bauble goes to your graveyard. After this, you crack a lotus bloom or 2 and/or ghost quarter a few lands that were tapped for mana, sac a pyrite spellbomb with to do 2 damage to target opponent, and then cast second sunrise. All the sacrificed permanents come back to the battlefield, and the second sunrise goes to the graveyard. Repeat 8 or 9 more times, win.


Card Choices :

Spoiler: Artifacts

Spoiler: EGGS
Chromatic Star: Itís 1 cmc. It fixes your mana. It draws you a card when it gets sacced. Itís one of the best Reshape fodder rocks ever. Play 4.

Chromatic Sphere: Itís better in Vintage Eggs because of Yawgmothís Will and worse here because it wonít yield a card when we sac it to Reshape. 4 of these are still essential, though, as 1 cmc mana-fixing rocks will not be denied.

Conjurerís Bauble: Shoving Edge of Autumns, Reshapes, and Noxious Revivals back into your library is good. You also donít need mana to draw a card with this 1 cmc rock. This is also the key to the main Sunny Side Up killóstuff a Second Sunrise into an empty library, draw it, pop a Pyrite Spellbomb, then cast Second Sunrise, getting everything back. This guy is the best egg in Riddlesmith builds, as you can shove discarded excess lands and stranded Lotus Blooms back into the deck.

Elsewhere Flask: Yes, it costs 2 mana. However, it immediately draws us a card and can sac itself for free, so itís in our books. Remember that its draw effect is mandatory and immediateóthin out the lands in your deck in response, Noxious Revival a Second Sunrise in response, and sac these last, in case you nab a Reshape and need a target or you are close to having an empty library. Also remember that it turns your Ghost Quarters and nonbasic lands into basic lands, so thatís another reason to sac these last.

Ichor Wellspring: Itís much worse than Elsewhere Flask, as it canít sac itself for free, but itís an awesome Reshape target. Remember that the draw occurs before Reshape resolves.

Mana Accel
Lotus Bloom: Suspending this first turn is fun. The turn this gets cast is the turn you should go off. Crack all your other eggs first, and then rip the petals off this flower when youíre just about to cast Second Sunrise. Alternately, Reshape acts as extra copies of Modernís own Black Lotus, and the turn you Reshape into this is the turn you should go off.

Mox Opal: Itís one free mana of any colour when you need it most. The fact that itís legendary hurts, though, as seconds are practically dead draws. Even if you sac the first to Reshape and play the second, they keep dying to the legend rule all the time afterwards. This card is better in Riddlesmith builds that treat seconds as the perfect discard fodder.

Locket of Yesterdays: With our cheap, easily cracked eggs, this modest 1 cmc artifact can give us serious mana savings. You may have to rearrange the order you smash your eggs with this card out, though.

Win Cons
Pyrite Spellbomb: Get a Second Sunrise with Conjurerís Bauble. Sac Lotus Bloom 1 for red mana. Sac Lotus Bloom 2 for white mana. Sac this with the red mana to ping your opponent. Cast Second Sunrise and get the Bauble, Spellbomb, and Blooms back. Repeat until your opponent dies. Killing Ethersworn Canonist is a plus, and it cantrips in a pinch.

Sunbeam Spellbomb: Does your opponent have a Leyline of Sanctity out? Then gain infinite life with this Spellbomb, then keep casting Noxious Revival targeting Noxious Revival until your opponent decks himself or herself (or deals with your constant infinite life and wins anyway). It also cantrips in a pinch and can give you a nice life buffer against aggro so you can keep cracking fetchlands or casting Noxious Revival without using mana.

Temple Bell: Thereís a pretty convoluted combo involving Noxious Revivals and Reshapes that allows you to force your opponent to draw his or her deck (while you donít) with this artifact. Itís an option, and it lets you (and your opponent) draw cards in the meantime.

Disruption
Defense Grid: Making your opponentís counterspells absurdly expensive is what this card does best. Beware of Spell Pierce, though, as your opponent just might be able to cast it if you were on the draw.

Pithing Needle: Got Tormodís Crypt problems? How about Relic of Progenitus or Nihil Spellbomb problems? Name those pesky rocks with this needle and you wonít worry about graveyard hate ever again!

Aether Spellbomb: Kicking out Ethersworn Canonist, Meddling Mage, Knight of the Reliquary, and more is pretty good. Being an (expensive) cantrip and a Reshape target means this is never a dead draw. If you run creatures, this is also an excellent bodyguard.

Nihil Spellbomb: This is the perfect graveyard hate rock for us. It exiles our opponentsí graveyards only and it cantrips! Too bad it needs black mana to be fully effective.


Instants and Sorceries

Spoiler: Recursion
Second Sunrise: The purpose of this deck is to break this card in half. It gives you immense card advantage as your artifacts, lands, and optional creatures and enchantments revive themselves. By looping this card, you can eventually draw you deck.

Open the Vaults: It can get you out of a giant hole if you fizzle, as it doesn't have the restriction of including only cards which came to the graveyard from play on the turn they ended up there. As Second Sunrises 5+, though, itís subpar, as it doesnít return lands and it is way more expensive.

Noxious Revival: This cardís sole duty is to put Second Sunrises from your graveyard on top of your library so you can draw them. Not actually needing green mana to cast this is awesome.

Reclaim: When four graveyard retrieval spells arenít enough, this fifth spell will do in a pinch. The need for actual green mana hurts, though.

Tutoring
Reshape: This cardís main purpose is to tutor for Lotus Bloom, thus basically giving this deck access to Black Lotus. Donít forget that it can tutor for eggs, other mana accel, or disruption in a pinch.

Wargate: Itís got a very restrictive mana cost, but searching for Lotus Blooms, Ghost Quarters, and more is pretty unreal. It can even tutor for creatures and enchantments!

Spoils of the Vault: If you still have trouble finding Second Sunrise, you can cast this card and kick yourself in the Ďnards trying to get that wonderful instant. Stick more than one win con in your deck if you use this card, though, as you donít want to exile your only way(s) of winning.

Cantrips
Edge of Autumn: You donít search for lands with this card. You cycle it by sacrificing lands. Youíll get those lands back with Second Sunrise, trust me.

Serum Visions: R.I.P. Ponder and Preordain. We knew ye well. Serum Visions is Preordainís backwards brother who doesnít dig nearly as well, but at least it shoves through dreck.

Sleight of Hand: Sleight of Hand is Preordainís other backwards brother who forces you to shove one card to the bottom and the other card into your hand, and it never lets you see a third card. Itís one of the best cantrips left to us, though.

Manamorphose: Old versions of this deck used this card as a simple free (well, itís 2 cmc, but it filters your mana) cantrip. Weíve got Elsewhere Flask on our side, though.

Gitaxian Probe: At least this free cantrip lets us stare at our opponentís hand and check whether we can spare one more turn against Zoo or if weíre walking into a counterspell wall. The life loss may hurt, though.

Win Cons
Grapeshot: It can smack your opponent for fairly high, to be sure, but getting 20 Storm with this card is near impossible unless youíve gone through at least three quarters of your deck. Itís probably better against decks with suicidal land bases and Bob and worse against decks with life gain.

Bitter Ordeal: It can boot out your opponentís entire deck, to be sure, but only after youíve gone through at least three quarters of your deck. If you fizzle and cast this card, youíre only slicing out half your opponentís deck at most. At least you get to snag their best cards (like most of their business spells).

Banefire: Only use in Lotus Cobra builds. At least you might need less mana than Emrakul demands from you (if your opponent is at 13 or less life, for example), but it might still not be necessary.

Removal
Echoing Truth: Staring down Pithing Needles naming Pyrite Spellbomb and Sunbeam Spellbomb or Meddling Mages naming Second Sunrise and Noxious Revival? Bounce them all with this handy card!

Repeal: Bounce anything interrupting your plans and draw a card! (Smart players will activate Tormodís Crypt in response, making this spell fizzle and ensuring your second Second Sunrise wonít do anything useful.)

Wipe Away: Ha ha, they canít activate Tormodís Crypt or Relic of Progenitus in response now! The 3 cmc is pretty steep, though.

Blasphemous Act: Stop Elves, and keep your life total safe! This stops weenie aggro for a while and keeps Goblin tokens from Storm decks from running you over before you can combo off.

Protection
Pact of Negation: Are they trying to counter your Second Sunrise? Stop those shenanigans for free! (You might not be able to pay the upkeep cost if you fizzle later, though.)

Silence: This card keeps those pesky blue mages from countering your other spells during your combo turn. The mana cost hurts, though.

Mindbreak Trap: UR Storm may be faster than us, but we can stop their Grapeshots and Empty the Warrens with this free card. (Of course, if they somehow shove two Grapeshots in your face, youíre probably doomed.)


Creatures

Spoiler: Mana Accel
Riddlesmith: Our goal in life is to cast artifact spells and keep digging for Second Sunrises (and Noxious Revivals). This guy will help us in that mission. Just cast eggs, draw cards, and discard lands and Lotus Blooms that get stranded in hand. Excess Mox Opals and other Riddlesmiths also make good discard fodder.

Lotus Cobra: With all the Ghost Quarters, basic lands, and fetchlands getting revived with Second Sunrise, this humble snake can give us a serious mana boost.

Etherium Sculptor: Making the majority of our eggs free is awesome and gives the deck a serious nitro boost. Being able to Reshape into him is a plus. Somewhat prohibitive mana cost though, may see play in Lotus Cobra builds.

Win Cons
Disciple of the Vault: Did your opponent Extirpate all the Pyrite Spellbombs from your deck? Kill your opponent by endlessly casting Second Sunrise and saccing your own Lotus Blooms and Conjurerís Baubles instead! If you fizzle, you might also be able to throw a few artifacts at your opponentís head and reap some benefits with this guy.

Laboratory Maniac: Who needs the infinite Pyrite Spellbomb kill when youíve got Laboratory Maniac and a ton of ways to draw cards at instant speed, often for free? If they attempt to exile this guy in response, just Bauble an Edge of Autumn into your hand and cycle it. This also doesnít target opponents, so you can dodge Leyline of Sanctity and Runed Halo with this win.

Emrakul, the Aeons Torn: Only use the Flying Spaghetti Monster in Lotus Cobra builds. Even then, it might not be necessary, but then again, it may save your butt if youíre accumulating mana and not cards.


Enchantments

Spoiler: Eggs
Ior Ruin Expedition: It requires a bit of preparation beforehand, but drawing 2 cards per Second Sunrise off it is oh so sweet. (Remember, everything pops onto the battlefield at the same time with Second Sunrise, and then Landfall triggers go on the stack.) It has the same cmc as Elsewhere Flask, though, which hurts.

Disruption
Blood Moon: Turning other decksí mana bases into junk can stall them for just about forever. Please be aware that this neuters your Ghost Quarters and fetchlands, though, so itís definitely a double-edged sword.


Lands

Spoiler: Coloured Mana
Island: How do you expect to cast Reshape without blue mana? Besides, searching for endless supplies of these with Ghost Quarters is fun.

Forest: If youíre splashing for Lotus Cobra and Wargate, this is a must-have.

Plains: If youíre splashing for Wargate, this is a must-have. Otherwise, just crack Lotus Blooms to get white mana.

Swamp: If youíre splashing for Spoils of the Vault, this is a must-have.

Utility
Ghost Quarter: In any other deck, all this does is turn opponentsí nonbasic lands into basic lands. In this deck, it turns our tapped lands into untapped basic lands. A few Second Sunrises later, weíve got piles of lands and a thinned-out deck.

Misty Rainforest, Scalding Tarn, etc.: Otherwise known as fetchlands, these are awesome as spare (if bad) copies of Ghost Quarter that cost life, canít destroy our tapped lands, and donít tap for mana. You need the redundancy, though, and they are musts if you splash other colours.


History :

Spoiler: The history of "eggs" is amusing, as it actually started out before the mirrodin rare Second Sunrise, which was added later to the egg shell (hah!) to make the sunrise combo. Many have already explained the history of this deck better than I ever could, so here are a bunch of articles that reference past lists and origins:

2004 "bad eggs" - no sunrise

2006 "Worlds (extended)"

2008 "EDNAE"

2009 "New additions to EDNAE"




Example Decklists :

Spoiler:
Preface
These are examples of the different approaches to the eggs combo in the Modern format. The eggs themselves do most of the fixing, so the idea of splash is kinda moot with the exception of setup spells.


Sunny Side Up
The namesake of the previous thread, this list is an example of the deck at its purist. You play eggs and mana rocks, and draw through the deck to win with pyrite spellbomb. This list includes the tech from the original posted list in this forum in wargate, which can fetch any permanent (which includes lands), and Wild Cantor as a faux lotus petal effect which the deck needs to cast wargate and such reliably. Also includes a cantrip for setup in Serum Visions to atleast find you your first Second Sunrise.

Sunny Side Up
Lands
6 Island
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Forest
1 Hallowed Fountain

Creatures
3 Wild Cantor

Spells
4 Serum Visions
3 Lotus Bloom
4 Reshape
4 Second Sunrise
4 Noxious Revival
4 Conjurer's Bauble
4 Chromatic Star
4 Chromatic Sphere
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
3 Elsewhere Flask
4 Edge of Autumn
1 Wargate
1 Mox Opal


Locksmith Eggs
In this version of the sunrise combo, the idea is to maximize the artifact count to play well with riddlesmith and Locket of Yesterdays. With both cards on the field, all the cost artifacts are played for free for every card after the first and this means they trigger smith's digging ability for free. This usually results in a very mana-lite combo that can have very deceptive reach and seems to hit turn 3 kills a fair amount of the time. This version is supplemented by a singleton Disciple of the Vault in order to round the edges on its highly variable early mid-game. Drawing him usually ends games before the combo reaches the end of your library.

LockSmith Eggs
Lands
8 Island
4 Ghost Quarter
2 Misty Rainforest
1 Scalding Tarn

Creatures
3 Riddlesmith
1 Disciple of the Vault

Spells
4 Second Sunrise
4 Noxious Revival
3 Locket of Yesterdays
4 Conjurer's Bauble
4 Chromatic Sphere
4 Chromatic Star
4 Reshape
4 Edge of Autumn
3 Lotus Bloom
4 Elsewhere Flask
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 AEther Spellbomb
1 Mox Opal


Lotus Eggs
This version utilizes both Lotus Cobra and Lotus Bloom to double up on lotus effects so that it can afford whatever it draws, and still cast and recur spells such as Wargate and Reshape to fetch out important pieces or extra draw effects. This build tends to look at these two cards as a toolbox and has a variety of options available given the large amounts of mana it's able to produce. And with 15 cards that lead to 3 mana recursion in the deck, you have about the same chance having it in your opening 7 as you would a land. Lotus Cobra itself has great synergy with the other components of the deck. Ghost Quarter, Misty Rainforest, and Edge of Autumn all become mana ramp in addition to being mana recursion, and this helps with getting eggs in hand onto the board. This is the slowest of the 3 builds, but is more consistent in the early-mid combo.

Lotus Eggs
Lands
7 Island
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Ghost Quarter
1 Forest

Creatures
3 Lotus Cobra

Spells
3 Lotus Bloom
4 Reshape
4 Second Sunrise
4 Noxious Revival
4 Conjurer's Bauble
4 Chromatic Star
4 Chromatic Sphere
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
4 Elsewhere Flask
4 Edge of Autumn
1 AEther Spellbomb
1 Courier's Capsule
1 Mox Opal
1 Wargate
1 Reclaim



Game Tips :

Spoiler:
Optimizing Recursion
There are a monumental number of little zone/stack manipulation and order of operation tricks for a pilot to learn and internalize in order to play the deck at the level of consistency the deck is designed to work at. When working with limited information, decisions are based on achieving the widest margin of possible future plays...

-After resolving second sunrise, the first order of business is to cast noxious revival targeting sunrise before you let any draw happen/resolve. Shuffling sunrise back into your deck if you already have a sunrise in hand also follows this rule. If you have no noxious revival + no sunrise in hand, leave the sunrise in the graveyard and move to other priorities until sunrise or noxious revival appears. If it's a noxious revival, cast it targeting the sunrise in your graveyard and then draw into it with either a conjurer's bauble (first choice) or some other draw effect (like chromatic star or edge of autumn).

-(continued) Thinning and shuffling your deck before digging is the next essential aspect of maximizing the potential of your draws. This means putting important pieces back in the deck with conjurers bauble, and then shuffling the deck with either reshape, ghost quarter, or fetchlands. Priority targets for conjurer's bauble: noxious revival, edge of autumn, excess sunrises in your graveyard past the first one, dead eggs/blooms which cannot be brought back via sunrise, pieces that are being targeted by an opponents spells that would exile it, and sometimes reshape. What NOT to bauble: any land, and any live egg or bloom. The exception to this is basic islands when you need a target in your library for ghost quarter or a fetchland, you need the mana that badly, and have no other priority targets present.

-Together, the above constitutes the most effective line of play post-sunrise. Here is an example of such a play:
You have just sunrised, and have returned all your eggs and lotus blooms from the graveyard and onto the battlefield. You have a noxious revival in hand and a conjurer's bauble on the board. You have a ghost quarter and an island on the board. Now, cast noxious revival targetting sunrise for or 2 life depending on the situation and mana available. Then, when noxious revival hits the graveyard, use conjurer's bauble to put the noxious revival back into your library. The conjurer's bauble then draws the second sunrise. Immediately after that, crack your ghost quarter targeting the island. In response, tap it for , let ghost quarter resolve and fetch another island from your library. Shuffle. THEN let any unresolved triggers that would draw a card resolve and start cracking eggs to dig through your library.

This is pretty much the defacto way to combo with the deck, though sometimes depending on the parts you are given, this is slightly modified here and there.

-Leave your options for mana open as long as possible (meaning don't crack the bloom the second you get it back from sunrise unless its mana is immediately required). Mana from basic lands are always the first to be used.

-Watch your life total when you use noxious or fetchlands, recurring sunrise with mana from fetchlands has a shelf life of exactly how many basics you run, minus whatever you draw into. The life loss from fetchland recursion and noxious revival also have a shelf life based on how much damage you have been dealt so far that game by your opponent. More on that is mentioned in the Interactions With You Opponent section.

-Most builds of Sunrise Combo will play maybe 15-18 lands, 7-8 of which are non-basic. Getting reshape for blooms is a priority when you have to use fetchlands instead of ghost quarter to recur sunrise.

-Eggs that have more interactions with other cards in your deck are the last to be cracked, so that your draw from other eggs might reveal those plays. Particularily, chromatic star is always your last egg on the board unless...

-When you find an interaction that thins and shuffles and has a target inside your library, like drawing a reshape to get bloom or a ghost quarter to get an island, use it at the next most appropriate opportunity. Do this because every time you draw, you risk stranding the intended target in your hand. In some cases, it is warranted to reshape something that won't draw a card before you can fetch a target from the library. For instance, if you have a lotus bloom out, and two more stranded in your hand, it'd be unlucky if you reshaped a chromatic star to get a lotus bloom, only to draw the lotus bloom off of chromatic stars graveyard trigger. This is unavoidable since the graveyard trigger goes on top of the stack after you cast reshape, but before reshape resolves, since the sacrifice of chromatic star is an additional cost.

Recursion Priority Lists
This section is a quick reference guide for what to sac, fetch, etc. and in what order. This is only a general guideline, and not necessarily always the right line of play...

1) cast reshape targeting... (in order of preference)
___1) Mox Opal (after tapping it for mana)
___2) Elsewhere Flask
___3) Chromatic Star
___4) Any other artifact
___and fetching, in order of preference
___1) Lotus bloom (if you have 1 or 0 currently)
___2) Chromatic Star or Elsewhere flask (if you have lots of extra mana)
___3) Conjurer's Bauble
___4) Chromatic Sphere
___5) Mox Opal (if you have another reshape in hand)
___6) Spellbomb or Elsewhere Flask
2) Crack ghost quarters and fetchlands
3) Crack eggs in the following order
___1) Chromatic Sphere
___2) Conjurer's Bauble, targeting...
______1) Noxious Revival
______2) Edge of Autumn
______3) Reshape
___3) Chromatic Star
___4) Aether, Pyrite Spellbomb
___5) Elsewhere Flask (only once you have the second sunrise in hand)

If at any point you draw another reshape, use it on the artifacts you have remaining in the above order.

4) Play second sunrise
5) Put elsewhere flask triggers on the stack
___1) respond by using noxious revivals on second sunrises and drawing them (use the draw from conjurer's bauble in step 2 if possible)
___2) respond by cracking conjurer's baubles and putting stuff on the bottom in the above order
___3) respond by cracking ghost quarters and fetchlands
6) repeat from the top, if possible.


Then You kill them Razz
btw this was C/P from somewhere else just thought it was a great primer on a decent deck Hope you enjoy.
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ishocrone



Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 112

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is my version atm

// Deck file for Magic Workstation (http://www.magicworkstation.com)
// NAME: Untitled Deck

// Lands
1 [DIS] Breeding Pool
4 [ISD] Ghost Quarter
1 [DIS] Hallowed Fountain
5 [ISD] Island (1)
2 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
2 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
1 [GP] Steam Vents

// Creatures
3 [ALA] Etherium Sculptor

// Spells
3 [MR] Chromatic Sphere
4 [10E] Chromatic Star
4 [FD] Conjurer's Bauble
4 [DDG] Edge of Autumn
4 [SHM] Elsewhere Flask
4 [TSP] Lotus Bloom
4 [NPH] Noxious Revival
1 [MR] Pyrite Spellbomb
4 [DS] Reshape
4 [MR] Second Sunrise
2 [FD] Serum Visions
1 [TSP] Grapeshot
2 [MR] Spoils of the Vault
1 [ARC] AEther Spellbomb

// Sideboard
SB: 1 [MR] Disciple of the Vault
SB: 1 [DDF] Echoing Truth
SB: 3 [TSP] Krosan Grip
SB: 1 [SOM] Ratchet Bomb
SB: 3 [M11] Silence
SB: 2 [9E] Defense Grid
SB: 3 [TSP] Wipe Away
SB: 1 [MR] Sunbeam Spellbomb
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blitzer2k7



Joined: 12 Jul 2007
Posts: 412

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

these all look like lots of fun lol
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ishocrone



Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 112

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

1 [DIS] Breeding Pool
4 [ISD] Ghost Quarter
1 [DIS] Hallowed Fountain
5 [ISD] Island (1)
2 [ZEN] Misty Rainforest
2 [ZEN] Scalding Tarn
1 [GP] Steam Vents
3 [SOM] Riddlesmith
3 [MR] Chromatic Sphere
4 [10E] Chromatic Star
4 [FD] Conjurer's Bauble
4 [DDG] Edge of Autumn
4 [SHM] Elsewhere Flask
4 [TSP] Lotus Bloom
4 [NPH] Noxious Revival
1 [MR] Pyrite Spellbomb
4 [DS] Reshape
4 [MR] Second Sunrise
1 [TSP] Grapeshot
1 [ARC] AEther Spellbomb
3 [TSP] Locket of Yesterdays
1 [SOM] Mox Opal
SB: 1 [MR] Disciple of the Vault
SB: 1 [DDF] Echoing Truth
SB: 3 [TSP] Krosan Grip
SB: 1 [SOM] Ratchet Bomb
SB: 3 [M11] Silence
SB: 1 [MR] Sunbeam Spellbomb
SB: 2 [9E] Defense Grid
SB: 3 [TSP] Wipe Away


OK I LIED THIS is my favorite turn 3 kills is always fun but i am at 61 trying to figure out what to make it 60 with
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

These decks are only fun to play if you like playing by yourself or explaining to your opponent the entire match each individual move.

That being said, I would drop a reshape in order to get down to 60 in Isochrones last list.

I would suggest dropping the aether spellbomb for another Grapeshot, reasoning is Mindbreak trap, Alot of decks have this in the board and if it does get countered by the trap you will generally lose if you can't keep it going.
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Canabiest



Joined: 15 Aug 2006
Posts: 367

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The decks worst enemy is the timelimit
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 8:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i agree with Canabiest, if your opponent acts dumb then he can get you to use all the time on the first game, which gives a tie for the round and you lose tiebreaks for the entire tourney.

I think the Lotus version should have 2 Grapeshot and 1 Demonfire with the amount mana it can produce. Relying just on the Pyro spellbomb or the Disciple takes a huge time commitment and if your opponent doesn't concede then you will end up losing in the end.
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Mizukage



Joined: 24 Jul 2009
Posts: 106

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EDIT: k
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a question, what is the game plan vs either a Cranial Extraction or a Surgical Extraction targeting your sunrise on turn 3, I mean I just give up at that point b/c I can't ramp into the shot or the burn.

I know there is silence but on turn 3, its just ridiculous.
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xJudicatorx



Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 696

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shouldn't Time Sieve be the number 1 have to have card in this deck?
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

xJudicatorx wrote:
Shouldn't Time Sieve be the number 1 have to have card in this deck?


No, because once the engine gets going you dont want to restart the storm counter on another turn.
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xJudicatorx



Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 696

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MassO wrote:
xJudicatorx wrote:
Shouldn't Time Sieve be the number 1 have to have card in this deck?


No, because once the engine gets going you dont want to restart the storm counter on another turn.


So it's really a different combo altogether?
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ishocrone



Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 112

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Time seive no cuz you should win on the turn you go off no need for extra turns i mean its a nice cantrip i suppose.
Time limit isn't an issue if you know how to play usually i can end a match in 10-15 min its not hard to draw your whole deck after 3-4 second sunrise. Main plan vrs extraction is well silence ur correct i haven't been able to figure anything else out but most decks play 2x-3x in sb and your playing silence so your gameplan lay as many eggs as u can to find a silence then go off at last second as far as cranial extraction your screwd this is combo u win or lose Smile. Mass0 disciple is easy win your sacing upwards of 6-7 artifacts each secondsunrise and when you put it back on the top of your library its pretty easy. You shouldn't have to explain in a real tournement because its fairly easy you sac artifacts reccur with second sunrise and use all their abilities again then kill. Aether is used against hate and Zoo atm its nice to bounce all zoos creatures but ill take it out probally for something else Ive made some major changes to the deck for the current meta and plan on playing in a trial hopefully to test it on M-l. The majority of the time ive played is casting grapeshot for the win the second win condition is spellbomb which doesnt take to much longer. This deck can be hated easily Chalice for 1-2-3 is hard to deal with. BG rock can be hard but winnable. Second you have the WDF is this guy playing factor alot of ppl don't know what im playing and ive won a few fnm's so far playing this list. Next week i lose horribly because its EASY TO HATE this deck is resilent though you just have to know your mu's and side properly the problem is if u lose g1 g2 can be hard because you don't know what your opp has in their board. Overall i love the deck it can win vrs control and aggro has problems vrs surgical and cranial and just the random you lose because your not drawing the right cards. Also just a random thought can u noxious revival ur second sunrise in response to an extraction so they have no legal targets? jw anyways its a primer hoped you guys enjoy keep brewing my next primer will be GW tokens and UW Pride of control deck Smile gotta love pride of clouds Razz
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xJudicatorx



Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 696

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh that reminds me isochrone. What is your answer to Rule of Law?
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ishocrone



Joined: 16 Mar 2006
Posts: 112

PostPosted: Thu Dec 15, 2011 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lmao Smile

SB: 1 [DDF] Echoing Truth
SB: 3 [TSP] Krosan Grip
SB: 1 [SOM] Ratchet Bomb
SB: 3 [TSP] Wipe Away

ratchet can be fetched with reshape kinda slow but it works. Smile Like i said this deck isn't the newest tier 1 deck and should be watched out for but i think it has potential and is fun to mess around with can wreck havoc at certain meta's. KEEP HATING THE EGGS KEEP HATING Smile
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