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Golems



 
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JJBeast



Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 7:15 am    Post subject: Golems Reply with quote

Ok, so whenever I see these deck postings they get flamed. But the other day, I saw Darking win a Modern tourney with Merfolk. The premise of the deck was to keep getting +1/+1 creatures stacking so that it would even overpower Zoo, which it obviously did. What made his deck different than even the 2nd place deck (which was also Merfolk) is that he added Adaptive Automation for another cheap +1/+1. By the way Darking, I think you should add Coralhelm Commander for a 5th +1/+1. So I thought, how can I make a similar stacking deck in T2 if this deck is powerful enough to win Modern. Obviously Adaptive Automation could be added to Vamps (but no other +1/+1), Gobs (but only Goblin King in addition), White Weenie or Tempered Steel, but you just have Enchantments which can't double as Stacked creatures. So I came up with this...BTW, this entire deck (expect 1 manland will still be T2 legal in 3 weeks when Inn comes out).

The deck has gone 10-1 to my suprise. And yes, my Sideboard sucks (please help), as I basically only sideboard to beat Aggro Red (which seems to be winning T2 alot). Here it goes, hopefully it doesn't get flamed as it wins much more than it seems it would (as Merfolk suprisingly won Modern).

// Lands
2 [NPH] Island (2)
6 [M12] Plains (1)
4 [SOM] Seachrome Coast
4 [M12] Glacial Fortress
4 [MBS] Inkmoth Nexus
4 [WWK] Dread Statuary

// Creatures
4 [M12] Adaptive Automaton
3 [M12] Solemn Simulacrum
3 [NPH] Spellskite
3 [NPH] Phyrexian Metamorph
4 [NPH] Master Splicer
4 [NPH] Blade Splicer

// Spells
4 [M12] Mana Leak
4 [SOM] Elspeth Tirel
3 [NPH] Karn Liberated
4 [SOM] Venser, the Sojourner

// Sideboard
SB: 4 [MBS] Sword of Feast and Famine
SB: 3 [NPH] Sword of War and Peace
SB: 4 [M12] Day of Judgment
SB: 4 [M12] Timely Reinforcements

So as you can see, the deck builds off the efficiency of Golems. So here is the card commentary.

Blade Slicer - Super efficient 3/3 first strike and 1/1 for 3 easy mana.
Master Slicer - Efficient 4/4, since Master makes ALL the Golems +1/+1
Solemn "The Golem" Simulacrum - It's Getting put into most decks anyway for its +2 card draw with Land, but it gets boosted in this deck since Solemn is a Golem. Also, when paid with Venser, Solemn becomes a poor-man's Primal Titan and pulls all your lands.
Adpative Automation - As with Darking, becomes another Golem that gives +1/+1 for only 3 mana
Spellskite - Necessary for the millions of reasons Spellskite rules...Stops Twin deck, Redirects UG pod (Frost Titan, Phyrexian Morph, Acidic Slime), Slows down Aggro Red with Redirect and blocking. Most importantly, protects your SLICERS (although most people try to kill the Golems).
Elspeth - Removal mainly. Because you will usually have 4-6 creatures out when she comes and a few Token Golems, you automatically use her Gain life ability (which protects against Aggro Red), so that the next turn you can Clear the Board. Most of the time Elspeth has to use her first turn to create 3 Soldiers, and then it is 3 more turns until she Clears the board, which is tough. But in this deck, she almost always will wipe the board on her second turn and leave some Big Golems out there.
Phyrexian Metamorph - Most of the time you'll just copy a Slicer to create another Golem. Phantasmal Illusion can be used here too, since the Golem which is created will remain regardless if the illusion is targeted. However, Phyrex has good synergy with Venser to keep changing to the Latest Bomb (like continually copying their Acidic Slime, Frost Titan permi-tap, or any Titan permi ability).
Venser - This is the REAL Engine to this deck. Much like Torpor Orb can almost completely shut down this deck, Venser can completely Pump this deck. Use Venser to Keep pulling lands with Solemn, or generate a new Golem EVERY TURN. Venser with Phyrex is explained above. Venser is great to use with the other Planeswalkers to allow for instance, Karn to Exile a Permanent on the board and then be reset back to 6 Counters. Ultimately with a Slicer and Venser in your opening hand you usually have a turn 7 win as Venser creates extra Golems and then sends them through as Unblockable.
Karn - At the very least Karn will be used to Exile 2 Perms and die, since their isn't alot of spot removal, but usually Karn is very protected by all the creatures and never dies.
Mana Leak - Early counter obviously. When I first created this deck, I had 8 counters and 4 Orings and it was a real Control deck (like Merfolk in a way). However, I realized the 3 Planeswalkers have way more synergy with the deck and even more spot removal (although a bit delayed). So the 4 Mana leaks are to slow the oppenent down just enough to get to the Planeswalkers.

So that is basically it. Go ahead and Flame Smile, I would like to hear your opinions. Again this deck is 10-1 right now. I know that this won't really happen against top decks (although I've faced 3 pods, Twin, Caw-Blade, and Vamps). I will really know if it gets into some Tourneys. I think Caw Blade still beats this, since this deck only has Inkmoth to protect from very early flyers (although Mana leak could slow it a bit until the Planeswalkers). Also, Swords don't work since these are all Colorless creatures. Torpor Orb Destroys this deck, although 2 of the 10 Games I did beat Torpor Orb out. And I haven't faced Aggro Red or Tempered Steel yet.
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struikje



Joined: 11 Mar 2011
Posts: 108

PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'll just tackle a few issues I have with the deck:

To much planeswalkers of the bad kind: ok, venser is good, and karn can be ok as a singleton, so can elspeth if you like her, but, you have no card draw at all, not even preordain, what practically is the best blue spell in standard. Get a Jace B or azure mage for card draw, play 2 gideons, 4 preordain is a must.

If you like the merfolk deck and want to play a fish deck in standard, go with the mono blue illusions deck. this deck does not match fish decks at all.

Creatures: spellskite should not be in mainboard, it just doesn't do anything. Get wing splicers instead, giving your golems some evasion much wanted evasion.

As your deck is now, it doesn't matter a thing if your creatures are artifacts, you will still get hit by sworded squadron hawks, as the only spot removal you have is 3 (!) karns.

The swords in the sideboard should go. Add a couple of flashfreeze vs valakut, divine offering/revoke existence vs torpor orb post bord, dismembers for vs twin, some midrange decks, ditch the swords, play moar gideon, ...

I think golem decks play a shape anew combo aswell, as it can just win you the game if people don't expect it.

There is no need to run 4 inkmoth and 4 dread statuary, just run 4 celestial collonades and tec edges. you have to much plains too I think. Collonade gives better mana, and is the better manland too. UW lists only run inkmoth nexus if they run swords, and never 4.

10-1 don't seem very representative results for that deck.
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JJBeast



Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, as I was saying. This entire deck is still legal in two weeks when Innistrad comes out. All three cards you suggested are gone in 18 days (preordain, tec edge, and celestial colonnade) it doesn't make sense to build a deck this late with cards that are leaving. Also, dread sanctuary is a golem so it gets the bonuses and first strike from ask the golem buffs. Why would I play colonnade over a golem that becomes 7/5 first strike by turn 5? you may be right about inkmoth but inkmoth with sword beats hawk with sword since inkmoth is colorless. Finally, you are right about no card draw. But neither Merfolk , Zoo, or any beatdown have card draw. Card draw is for filing up your deck to get the right combo, which is why twin is full of ponder, preordain, and other draw until the combo comes. Same with caw-blade. Beatdown isn't looking for combo which is why you will never see aggro red or vamps replace a valuable beatdown card for card draw. The idea is to just keep streaming vamps our gobs or merfolk or zoo creatures until you win. This is Golem beatdown. Note I spouse I could replace Elspeth with Jace for draw but as you pointed out I have very few removal. Elspeth clears the whole board except the tokens on her second turn. It is like a very good and cheap All is Dust. You have tried to turn this deck into a bad version of caw-blade with the Gideon, preordain, celestial colonnades, and tech edges. I suppose I should swap out the master splicers for hawks and the karn for swords and I will be very close. And then in two weeks when all those cards are illegal in t2 I will just build this golem deck.
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struikje



Joined: 11 Mar 2011
Posts: 108

PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I didn't think of post rotation legality, your second post doesn't make much sense. I think its clear that if your deck has 4 venser, 4 Elspeth and 3 karns, you are nowhere near a beatdown deck, and you will need to cast preordain to get landdrops, let alone carddraw.

Playing sad robots, all those PW's, mana leak, Spellskite, does not make a beatdown deck. Your earliest plays, is a turn 2 spellskite/mana leak. I hope you see that that won't pressure an opponent.

You cannot rely on elspeth as removal. If you are behind on board, you need to -2 to defend her. If they have just a single flying creature on board, you cannot defend her period. Elspeth needs to be 2 turns in play and your opponent does not have any removal/burn/flying creature for it to work as removal.

I'm not saying gollem deck is automatically bad. Your card choices just don't make any sense to me at all.

Edit: about preordain/ponder not being in beatdown decks: You are talking about modern/legacy beatdown decks (merfolk/zoo). The cardpool is much bigger then standard is, as is the format much faster. Examples of a beatdown that included blue, is Patrick Chapins RUG-pod deck (w/o twincombo), that included 4ponder and 2 preordains...
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darkwizard42
Level 2 Judge


Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Mon Sep 12, 2011 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Merfolk plays a very intense tempo game.

They use Vial to push in threats while keeping counter mana up. Your deck simply casts Golems...FOUR Venser??? What do you do when you draw the second one and one is in play...Most Caw decks play 25+ lands and that is with 3-5 cards above 5cc and yet you are playing 11 cards with only 24 lands. Don't even for a second suggest Solemn Simulacrum is your accel...

Is your sideboard thought out at all?
Why are you playing 7 Swords? Your only hate on SplinterTwin are spellskites, you have zero hate against Valakut, and any Caw deck will play board sweepers to which your answer is 4 Mana Leaks.

Bottom line, you may have won some games based on sheer forcing through of threats, but that is definitely not the way to judge how "good" your deck is. This thing needs card draw, and a more intelligently designed curve, as its far too top heavy right now...3 karn...and 24 lands
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JJBeast



Joined: 10 Jul 2011
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2011 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So rather than argue with Darkwizard (Darking??) at the time, I decided to take it off line. Obviously I was building this deck for the ISD release and didn't care about Valakut or Twin hate, but Dark decided to flame and not even see my commments about "Post-release".

This deck though was losing alot to RDW, so I took it offline as well. However, I have brought it back to much success now with a very small change. I have put the DoJ in the Mainboard and the Karn in the Sideboard and it now beats RDW just fine, especially after I sideboard Timely Reinforcements. There are some other small changes, such as Wing Splicer instead of Automation (which helps against all the flying Tempered Steel decks and Inkmoths) and Oblvion instead of Mana Leak (Since Solar Flare and UB control have plenty of Mana for Leak). But this deck is mostly in tact and does well.

It is a natural counter to Solar Flare, since our Elspeths and DoJ's control/Cancel each other, yet all of the Golems are greater than Solar's Blade Slicer and Sun Titan. It is funny to see Struikje comment now that Elspeth is not removal. As you see NOW with Solar Flare, she is TOTAL control with the DoJ in front of her. The fact that Golems are two creatures really hurts UB Control because they are slow enough that I don't cast my whole hand like RDW or Tempered Steel, therefore the Sweep cards aren't effective, and they are in 2 pieces so the Doom and GfTT can't get them. This is also why Solar flare beats UB Control because they slowly get out separate little creatures with Elspeth and Reinforcements. UB can't handle all of the threats in piecemeal.

And the DoJ's, Oring's, and Revoke Existence, plus the Elspeth really handle Pod decks. By the way, the 4 Venser's are VITAL in this deck. The Venser is the Card Draw since she can reset your Slicers to create more Golems as well as Resetting your Elspeth Counters or Karn Counters when you use their Negative Abilities. She controls the board and is a much greater threat the Elspeth, if you can believe that. Finally, with people playing so many Legendary creatures now (Thrun in every Green, Elesh Norn in every Pod or Solar deck, Geist out alot), the Phyrexian Metamorph is perfect as more removal for those hard to remove creatures, while also being great 3cc Slicers if not removing. Frankly, if the Metamorph is out early as a slicer, you just Reset him as a Legendary creature with Venser when the time comes.

Again, I am not going to pretend that I dominate all of the best decks as even Caw Blade only had a 65% win rate in tourneys. So, I think a deck is successful if it can fare about 50% against the top decks. And so far this has fared much better than 50% or even 60% (although this isn't Tourney play)

So here is the new list, it really isn't much different than the old one, which I was flamed for (Wing Splicer, DoJ, Oring, and Moorland Haunt MainBoard).

// Lands
2 [NPH] Island (2)
6 [M12] Plains (1)
4 [SOM] Seachrome Coast
4 [M12] Glacial Fortress
4 [MBS] Inkmoth Nexus
4 [ISD] Moorland Haunt

// Creatures
4 [NPH] Wing Splicer
3 [M12] Solemn Simulacrum
3 [NPH] Spellskite
3 [NPH] Phyrexian Metamorph
4 [NPH] Master Splicer
4 [NPH] Blade Splicer

// Spells
4 [M12] Day of Judgement
4 [SOM] Elspeth Tirel
3 [M12] Oblivion Ring
4 [SOM] Venser, the Sojourner

// Sideboard
SB: 3 [NPH] Karn Liberated
SB: 4 [SOM] Revoke Existence
SB: 4 [M12] Remember the Fallen
SB: 4 [M12] Timely Reinforcements
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