Red Deck Wins w/SHM

Squee_Goblin · Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 13

Everyone is thinking it, I am just saying it. "How good will mono red aggro be post-shadowmoor?" Here is my take on it.

Red Deck Wins
60 Cards

4 Karplusian Forest(look in the board)
4 Fire-lit Thicket
2 Vivid Crag
11 Mountain
////////21 Land////////

4 Tattermunge Maniac (Greatest red one cost 2/1 ever?)
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Vexing Shusher (So Good in so many matchups and a 2/2 for 2)
4 Mogg War Marshal (Great in the mirror)
3 Countryside Crusher (Hate to draw 2)
4 Boggart Ram-Gang
4 Ashenmoor Gourger (Self explanitory)
////////27 Creatures///////////

4 Lash Out (>Incinerate)
4 Rift Bolt
4 Flame Javelin
//////12 Spells///////

Sideboard:
3 Everlasting Torment (Turbofog/other life gaining decks)
4 Guttural Response (Any of those pesky control deck/anything blue)
4 Frayalise's Radiance (Just look at the lands played by RG ramp...lol)
4 Seal of Primodium (Red never could remove enchantments, helpful)

So far I have only been beaten once after extensive testing, against mana ramp, that is why i play Frayalise's Radiance. I would really like to hear some feedback but just please don't post things like "u suck" I would be happy to hear reasons that my deck wasn't good though. If you copy this deck and play it, please tell me how u did.

EDIT: 2 Vivid Crag

tfunk1940 · Joined: 28 Feb 2007 Posts: 70

you have too many 3 casting cost dudes. as much as i hate to say this, you might want to run goyf or keldon marauders. mutavault and/or treetop village are probably good inclusions as well.

Squee_Goblin · Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 13

i had goyf for a while but i never had the green mana, i have the goyfs and the mutavaults but with mutavault there is no tribal synergy and i NEED 3 red on turn 3. with the keldon, he is a consideration, but what would i drop?
EDIT: Also, i count rift bolt as a one drop so if u think about it, I will almost always have a turn one. If the other player has a creature, lash out is a great turn 2 play and after that why would I want anything but a three cost? Playing multiple spells a turn is great but the three costs are all soo great.

avataroflaw · Joined: 31 Aug 2004 Posts: 38

the obvious lashout > incinerate comment means that we should just ignore this thread.

Honestly, no keldon marauders, the single best two drop in red?!

Since when has mogg war marshal = aggro?!

please ignore this thread everyone.

gypsy · Joined: 15 Jun 2007 Posts: 1267

how is mogg war mashall not aggro? its rly good in red mirrors especially with pendlehaven

Tonya · Joined: 11 Oct 2004 Posts: 55

Cranemaker21 · Joined: 08 Jun 2006 Posts: 71

The original posted deck seems like it is trying to be aggro and aggro control at the same time... I think it should go one way or the other, play SGC and being aggro control or cutting the higher end stff for maruaders and burn spells.

silver_spawn · Joined: 19 May 2007 Posts: 17

I see the R/G deck a little bit different than the Squee_Goblin's version:

For example I would paly more burn spells and less creatures. In these king of decks creatures are just a mean for doing more dmg. You have to look at them like burn spells. When your Maniac deals 2 dmg to the opponent it's like you've played Shock, and when he deals 4 dmg it's like you've played 2 Shocks with a single card. So you have to keep your cheapest and fastest creatures which are capable of doing a lot of dmg in the first few turns and cut the rest. When your opponents are finally able to manage your threads, they would be alrready in your burn range and you just have to play some burns to finish them.

My suggestions are:
-4 Shusher(he is not fast and not capable of doing a lot of dmg; his abilities are irrelevant agains a 70% of the decks; he is surely an excellent sideboard card)
-4 Mogg War Marshal- he is not aggressive by any means and I wouldnt play him if if I don't play GGargadon
-4 Ashenmoor Gourger - he is good and 4/4 for 3 mana but have a few disadvantages ; 3 red wouldn't be always accomplishable on turn 3; obviously can't block, which may be important against other agro decks
-2 Vivid Crag - to have taplands in this kind of deck is just suicidal unless they are Treetop Villages

+4 Tarmogoyf or GGargadons
+4 Keldon Maraoders
+4 Incinerate
+2 Treetop Village - awesome post WoG attacker

thedarkness · Joined: 13 Jul 2006 Posts: 506

@ Tonya: your list is probably the most solid one I've seen in this thread, and your additions are logical and sound.

This is the list I've been testing myself, though I've been testing a lot of other decks on the side, including a goblins list that has performed very well.

Lands
4 Mutavault
4 Ghitu Encampment
16 Mountain

Creatures
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Tattermunge Maniac
4 Keldon Marauders
4 Boggart Ram-Gang

Spells
4 Flame Javelin
4 Incinerate
4 Lash Out
4 Shard Volley
4 Rift Bolt

Sideboard
SB: 4 Sulfurous Blast
SB: 4 Vexing Shusher
SB: 3 Everlasting Torment
SB: 4 Dragon's Claw

I think that's pretty damn funny, but it could just be me.

Someone convinced me a while back to try Ram-Gang in burn, and it's solid, but I'm still not convinced that it's better than maindecking Sulfurous Blast...

Also, Lash Out is better than Shock to my eyes; even though it costs more, it CAN hit both a creature and a player, and at worst, kills a creature and filters away a card you don't want.

Lash Out would be the slot I would replace with Browbeat.

Also, I'd never even consider not running a play set of Ghitu Encampment. This deck wants to accomplish as much as possible with as few cards as possible, as I'm sure all the readers of this thread know perfectly well, and 8 man-lands serves this purpose very well.

Finally, Pyroclasm doesn't really kill anything. Sulfurous Blast is better, and maybe Firespout if you're not terribly worried about Faeries or if you maindeck Blasts.

Edit: and here's a list I'm testing as I type this. It focuses less on creatures, more on burn.

Every spell in this deck, and 1/3 of the lands, want to kill you. O_O

Lands
4 Mutavault
4 Ghitu Encampment
16 Mountain

Creatures
4 Mogg Fanatic
4 Keldon Marauders

Spells
4 Flame Javelin
4 Incinerate
4 Sulfurous Blast
4 Shard Volley
4 Rift Bolt
4 Lash Out
4 Browbeat

Sideboard
SB: 3 Everlasting Torment
SB: 4 Manabarbs
SB: 4 Magus of the Moon
SB: 4 Dragon's Claw

It occurs to me that Vexing Shusher is fairly useless in burn..if they counter a burn spell..it should be easy enough to replace, no? Shusher should really be for forcing through a single important spell, because that's about how long he SHOULD be staying in play. >_>

silver_spawn · Joined: 19 May 2007 Posts: 17

Boggart Ram-Gang seems very versatile and fast-beating and serves the deck purposes well. BUT... I'm not convinced the mana base you offered could support 3 R/G mana on turn three very consistent. 4 Mutavaults and 4 Ghitu Encampments mean taht you can't play any of them till your third turn or you won't be able to cast your Ram-Gang then. I'm pretty sure you'll lose a lot of close games until you figure taht out.

rdeg87 · Joined: 29 Apr 2007 Posts: 277

How good is Tattermunge Maniac in an enviroment filled with Bitterblossom

BusDriver · Joined: 28 Jan 2006 Posts: 132

Tonya version looks ok
But 24 lands is to much, plus it could really use another 2-drop
I would just cut the mutavault period, go with encampments or keldon megalithis.
22 lands is more than enuff, ur curve is very low.
Muddbrawler cohort seems ok.
Maybe even blood knight

six · Joined: 19 Apr 2008 Posts: 68

yeah, the Mudbrawler could certainly be in there for consideration. I know it's standard, not sealed, but it can get in there with the Maniac on turn 2 for a cool 4 point swing. One more turn of creatures hitting and the game should be over with burn.

Stucco · Joined: 14 Mar 2005 Posts: 595

// Lands
19 [TSP] Mountain (3)
3 [MOR] Mutavault

// Creatures
3 [PLC] Blood Knight
3 [MOR] Countryside Crusher
4 [SHM] Tattermunge Maniac
4 [SHM] Boggart Ram-Gang
4 [10E] Mogg Fanatic
4 [PLC] Keldon Marauders

// Spells
3 [SHM] Flame Javelin
4 [10E] Incinerate
4 [TSP] Rift Bolt
3 [MOR] Shard Volley
2 [9E] Shock

Ram-Gang is a very good card and you want it in play on turn 3. You basically plow through any defensive creatures and take a large chuck out of larger creatures due to wither. And haste, can't forget that either. Hence, you can't play too many ghitu's and muta's. As a result, I only went 3 mutavault and left out the tempo-losing ghitu.
Ashenmoor Gouger was left out because I felt the CA of Crusher and the quick beats of Ram-Gang were of better value. Those combined with Flame Javalin seemed to be more than enough 3 drops.

This deck yields:
14 possible Turn 1 (excluding Volley obv)
10 possible Turn 2
10 possible Turn 3+
The deck runs 22 lands, 22 creatures, and 16 spells. I've been toying with -1 crusher, +1 Blood Knight to help the curve a bit.

Oh, and about the mostly burn decks. Look out for Kitchen Finks. That card will be a bitch to deal with.

Just my 2 cents on Monored at this point.

SaTiVa · Joined: 09 Jun 2005 Posts: 272

Here is what ive been trying for RDW in post shadowmoor essentially my idea is to NOT give them a good target for removal:

// Deck file for Magic Workstation (http://www.magicworkstation.com)

// Lands
3 [10E] Ghitu Encampment
15 [LRW] Mountain (4)
2 [FUT] Horizon Canopy
4 [MOR] Mutavault

// Creatures
4 [PLC] Keldon Marauders
4 [10E] Mogg Fanatic
4 [SHM] Fulminator Mage

// Spells
4 [10E] Incinerate
4 [TSP] Sulfurous Blast
4 [MOR] Shard Volley
4 [TSP] Rift Bolt
2 [LRW] Lash Out
4 [SHM] Flame Javelin

// Sideboard
SB: 4 [10E] Dragon's Claw
SB: 4 [FUT] Magus of the Moon
SB: 4 [10E] Cryoclasm
SB: 3 [SHM] Everlasting Torment

Note the deck is 2 cards shy as im not sure what i really want it to be, also i run 24 lands but it seems to be right with the 7 man lands and the 2 canapy... also as im typing this i realized i should prolly go -1 mountail + 1 pendlehaven