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3rd turn win that removes all opponents cards from the game?


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Reply to topic    Magic-League.com Forum Index -> Standard (T2) Decks

3rd turn win possible that removes all of opponents cards from the game?
yes
60%
 60%  [ 6 ]
no
40%
 40%  [ 4 ]
i know how to do it!!!
0%
 0%  [ 0 ]
Total Votes : 10

Author Message
Kniver



Joined: 16 Jan 2007
Posts: 16

PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have answer, krosan grip you platinum angel gg,
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Eldar



Joined: 27 Nov 2006
Posts: 435
Location: Rochester

PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why would you need luminescent rain when you could just play the "hey I am an elf", essence warden to gain infinite life. ;p.
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DaveK



Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 54

PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The entire magic community, through the sheer amounts of competitive play that occurs every year, has been shaped is such a way that each person belonging to this community looks at every idea pragmatically. You might think it's bad, but just face it - at core, magic is a competitive game and the judgment of ideas will be always based on pragmatic criterias - whether it be consistency or something else, it doesn't matter. What matters, though, is that all ideas which can not withstand criticism and which do not yield satisfactory results will be discarded very quickly.

If you want to tinker about complex intellectual structures, you will probably like high-level mathematics or physics. It does require mind dexterity and you surely will be entitled to call somebody less intelligent than you once you get to know all that stuff. And it will, at least, be a little bit more useful than theorizing about interactions of a few magic cards and then calling people stupid when they can't guess which cards you meant.
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ransom3



Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 185

PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
no the point of this thread was for him to say "LOOK WHAT I FIGURED OUT!!!"


Agreed.
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Vedrfolner



Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 2325

PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aftab wrote:
Its good to see creativity and it sucks that the first thing people do is criticize the guy. Magic is about being creative and clever and he's pretty much hit the nail on the head. I didn't see a sign anywhere specifying that this forum was only for serious competitive play. If people were more constructive with their comments, this would be an even better community for magic deck design as a whole.

Quote:
If you said "going infinite on turn 3" instead of "WINNING on turn 3", all guesses at what the combo did, would be more far-fetched and therefore closer to your theory. A combo that wins on turn 3 is something entirely different; it is a viable deck, first of all - and it should do it consistently.

I also came up with a combo that goes infinite (though not on turn 3).

Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder
Grinning Ignus
Thermopod

+ Blaze/Disintegrate

All you need is to have 5 mana untapped with Endrek in play, then play Thermopod, and keep sacing Thrulls while replaying Ignus.


Even though I seriously respect you, its stupid to use this as a reason to flame this guy.


I wouldn't call what I said there flaming. I call it critique. I don't criticize the idea itself, but the way he presented it.

The point of mentioning "my" combo, in case you didn't notice, was that the combo is obvious once you look at Thermopod. I could brag about my genious creativity, stating that I was the first to spot this combo, but I didn't. Especially since everyone reading Thermopod would eventually come up with the same thing eventually - except that, and this is my entire point here; no-one bothered about it because it isn't possible to make a good deck out of it. The exercise is pointless because it yields no useful end product.

Take a good look at Heritage Druid. What do you see? A good card? No. A card that could possibly produce a lot of mana if you had a lot of elves or could untap them for less than 3 mana? Yes. What cards are available to produce a lot of elves? Elvish Promenade and Hunting Triad, mainly. You make sure that you maximise those three card's potential by including other one-drop elves, and you could produce a loop if you could draw enough cards.

This is what Noobmellow has done. Why haven't anyone else come up with this idea? The answer is simple: It can't be pulled off consistently, so it isn't possible to make a good deck out of it. The exercise is pointless because it yields no useful end product.
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exactly what is a useful end product could not getting some people to explore the possibilities and think outside the box, challenging people be an end product itself. Any University teacher would tell you that it is. The end product is the solution the satisfaction of having solved the puzzle or at least tried. If people have done that then it has achieved something even if it is not visible, though in the form of an intelligent discussion on the matter there clearly is an end product. Certainly there is a lot more scope for an end product than simply a good magic deck. Why would wizards constantly do magic the puzzling I believe though I’m not sure there are even books on it, it achieves no useful end product if you look at in narrow minded terms. Yet people still read the webpage many in fact.

Fun can be an end product and perhaps a bit of fun was what the author was trying to have; we could all do with a bit more fun in our lives. Instead he found himself insulted for no real reason.

Some people here see no more to life than magic and the snobbery within the game instantly judging people on how or what they play, do or do not know at a card game these people are epic losers, there is nothing worse to judge people on then how they play a card game. Not everyone takes them so seriously there are a lot more important things in life then magic. I get fed up with people who have no respect for somebody simply because they perceive them as a ‘bad player’ and are too narrow minded to understand that people play for different reasons than there own. There are few good reasons to be rude to someone because you perceive them as not being good at a card game or not grasping the scenario you are presenting to them is no reason to be. If anything it shows a lack of communication and social skills which is very common in people who play this game. This message is for both sides of this argument as you are both at fault with regards too the later point of my post.
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Vedrfolner



Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 2325

PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

noobmellow wrote:


you can want me to tell you how?

I was just seeing if anyone else was creative enough to figure out this crazy combo.

Anyone else figure it out?

I don't think so.


So this is not snobbery?

Don't get me wrong. I make and play my own decks, and I appreciate the feeling of achieving something clever - something that is mine own. I don't try to be novel at all costs, though, because I know that there are better players than me, better deck-builders and I also know that these players use a lot more time than I could possibly manage on this game.

I have never even considered Noobmellow's abilities as a magic player based on this thread, on his deck idea. It has nothing to do with anything related to the discussion. I get it. I get the combo, and I get that the deck is not supposed to be competitive or anything. It is not even meant to be a deck. I get it and I did much the same thing when I made that Thermopod deck, except that I didn't present it as a puzzle meant to divide the cream (creative, imaginative players) from the crop (sheeple that mindlessly download Da Best Decks from the internets).
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Cedabrik



Joined: 20 Apr 2005
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well Put.

100% True
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bigballer11



Joined: 11 Feb 2008
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

how are you getting all your mana all you have is 1 harbinger and 1 chromatic star
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Clatanoff



Joined: 30 May 2007
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ya agreed. fun little clever game man I had fun thinking about it. sad that people would be bitter indeed. and ya stumped me but I had fun thinking about it.
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dv8r



Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 239

PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 3:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1) I agree with Verdolfnor completely, the thing that pisses me off about this thread is the whole "look at me, I can do this, I'm so so so clever don't you agree?" The tournament viability of the deck was NEVER in question.

2) What Trotsky1 is basically saying is: "This is what is wrong with magic, I'm going to sit here and be a whiney bitch about it instead of getting out there and DOING something about it"
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exactly how was i being whiney I was simply stating. Raising awareness by highlighting the issue is doing something about it.

Also I only play magic on the internet so getting out there for me is pretty much being on the internet and voicing my opinion i do that also. For these reasons I dont really care about the irl it doesnt affect me and Im not such a saint that I care to change something that doesnt affect me.

Exactly what do you propose I do about it bitch and I'll see what i can do?
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dt



Joined: 13 Nov 2007
Posts: 45

PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 5:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Take a good look at Heritage Druid. What do you see? A good card? No. A card that could possibly produce a lot of mana if you had a lot of elves or could untap them for less than 3 mana? Yes. What cards are available to produce a lot of elves? Elvish Promenade and Hunting Triad, mainly. You make sure that you maximise those three card's potential by including other one-drop elves, and you could produce a loop if you could draw enough cards.

This is what Noobmellow has done. Why haven't anyone else come up with this idea? The answer is simple: It can't be pulled off consistently, so it isn't possible to make a good deck out of it. The exercise is pointless because it yields no useful end product.



The exercise is not pointless.

Here's magic pro Kuan-Kuan Tian talking about how they came up with the idea for the Protean Hulk / Body double extended deck:

Quote:
As usual, Ackland was talking about all the terrible (but hilarious) decks that he's designed for the Extended PTQ season. One of these decks was a remake of Tsuyoshi Fujita's Sneak Attack deck from GP Seattle that used Through the Breach and Cauldron Dance to power out Dragon Tyrants and Bogardan Hellkites. While we were all laughing at how bad the deck was, I suddenly suggested whether it would be a better idea for us to “Flash” out a Protean Hulk using Through the Breach and Cauldron Dance instead. This got everyone's creative juices flowing but we were ultimately unable to come up with a very good way of winning the game...


Bad deck designs are the fruit for tier 1 glory.

However terrible you might think this combo is, this is magic deck design at its most elemental. A player sees a couple of cards, or a set of cards which interact in a way that catches their interest or imagination, and then you go from there.

That noobMellow's combo sucks in whosever's opinion doesn't matter. What matters is that he had an idea, and wanted to share it. that is all.


Incidentally, Heritage druid isn't that bad - you probably don't need me to tell you that Tsuyoshi Fujita built an elf deck around heritage druid and played it with great success at GP Shizuoka. Heritage druid isn't as bad a card as you're making it out to be, it just needs to be played in the right deck.

By his own admission, the elf deck he built was for "fun" and he said that he probably would have played some sort of reveillark deck if it had been a PT instead of a GP, but the fact is: Heritage druid is what gave Fujita's decklist an explosiveness which other elf decklists couldn't match.
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Vedrfolner



Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 2325

PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My entire point is that no-one bothered to brainstorm or use a lot of energy on the "quiz" in this thread because the information that it used Heritage Druid and could win on turn 3 told people that it would not result in a good deck.

However, people's lack of interest in the actual combo idea was interpreted as lack of creativity and deck design skill, and so we have a 40+ post thread discussing not a combo but poor forum conduct.
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Batibot23



Joined: 14 Dec 2006
Posts: 31

PostPosted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why don't you use Angel's Grace instead of Platinum Angel?
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