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Amaterasu
Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 70
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 Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 12:14 am Post subject: What's wrong with Ron Paul?? |
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| seriously, I don't understand this...wtf is wrong Ron Paul. Sure he's conservative. So what? Granted I found out about him not too long ago, from what I've read so far on his website, the guy is amazing, and, based on what I've read, would be an awesome president. |
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NahHolmes
Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Posts: 588
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 12:37 am Post subject: Re: What's wrong with Ron Paul?? |
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| Amaterasu wrote: | | seriously, I don't understand this...wtf is wrong Ron Paul. Sure he's conservative. So what? Granted I found out about him not too long ago, from what I've read so far on his website, the guy is amazing, and, based on what I've read, would be an awesome president. |
That's quite an endorsement, I mean sure you JUST heard about him even though he's been in politics for like 30 years but you took the time to research him on his own website.  |
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center425
Joined: 06 May 2006
Posts: 366
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 12:55 am Post subject: |
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Well, my personal feelings on him are not good. He would attempt to elimnate many government organizations and would love to withdraw from the international stage. These type of policies haven't worked in the past and I don't believe they will work in the future.
Last edited by center425 on Sat Jan 12, 2008 1:00 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Amaterasu
Joined: 14 Sep 2006
Posts: 70
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 12:56 am Post subject: Re: What's wrong with Ron Paul?? |
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| NahHolmes wrote: | | Amaterasu wrote: | | seriously, I don't understand this...wtf is wrong Ron Paul. Sure he's conservative. So what? Granted I found out about him not too long ago, from what I've read so far on his website, the guy is amazing, and, based on what I've read, would be an awesome president. |
That's quite an endorsement, I mean sure you JUST heard about him even though he's been in politics for like 30 years but you took the time to research him on his own website. |
lol, good point...although, granted I'm only 19...I wouldn't have heard of him for too long anyway.
about the research...yeah...i know...
edit: alright, did a bit of a more...biased...google search ("cons of ron paul, why ron paul is bad, thinks of the like)...I got nothing...seriously...if they do have something bad to say about him, it's that he voted against something. Period. Not why (which, if they mentioned, would probably make sense). |
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NahHolmes
Joined: 13 Jan 2005
Posts: 588
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 2:59 am Post subject: Re: What's wrong with Ron Paul?? |
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| What about Ron Paul makes him appealing to you btw? |
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Hank333
Joined: 23 Oct 2006
Posts: 218
Location: San Antoni
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 5:06 am Post subject: |
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Ron Paul is my go to guy. I love ron paul.
He is a strict constutionialist.
He is a FISCIAL conservative.
He is agianst the war.
He is Pro Individual liberty.
He wants to shrink the goverment, and eliminate excess buracracy.
He is the only canidate who talks about real issues, most of the candidates talk but manage to never say anything particular meaningful.
I think ron paul is the only guy who doesn't say things because he thinks they are the popular things to say, he says things because they are what he believes.
He is the only canidate who won't walk us straight into the new world order.
Ron Paul 2008!!! |
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Deuce
Joined: 06 Oct 2007
Posts: 58
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 6:09 am Post subject: |
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| center425 wrote: | | Well, my personal feelings on him are not good. He would attempt to elimnate many government organizations and would love to withdraw from the international stage. These type of policies haven't worked in the past and I don't believe they will work in the future. |
I'm not US citizen but still I see USA afffairs important since it might affect myself if it keeps this policy. I wouldn't say withdrawing from international stage won't work.  I mean money you spend overseas, like he says, is just sick amount. What could you do even with half of that in your home front. There is no reason for you to meddle in others affairs, really. And of course that meddling causes the people who are being target of that to become more and more aggressive towards you. I'd like example how this policy hasn't worked since I'm not the most familiar with US history and can't recall such. 
And how won't policy on goverment organizations work. I personally think less bureacrasy is always better. It's really annoying here in Finland but I can't imagine what it would be in US.
And the money that goes in keeping those organizations up..
Anyway, I'm just outside observer but I still think that Ron Paul has it right on those affairs that can somehow affect us here elsewhere. |
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BusDriver
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 132
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 7:27 am Post subject: |
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Deuce: try world war one and two, I'm sure you've heard of those.
The definition of a great power is exactly the fact that it mingles in foreign affairs.
The thing is, whenever there is an interantion crisis the US is needed to solve the problem, simply because they're the only ones capable of doing so. The only other ones that have the economic capacity to do so are japan (which is obliged to have a small milatery) or the EU (which can't put an army together).
Also the US needs other countries. If the world goes to shit both US oil supply and trade would be shut down, resulting in a major crisis, possibly with no solution. Cost of living would go up dramatically and lots of people would lose their jobs. Even at the beginning of the 20th century this was so, and the world has only gotten more globalised. Also the US has lost it's economic hegemony a few decades ago, so falling back on itself could be even more dangerous.
From a practical point of view this would be very bad and it wouldn't testify of great moral either.
Obviously not all foreign actions are good (hello Iraq), but one country cannot simply count on itself. To think this is possible testifies of great ignorance. |
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ransom3
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 156
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Craze
Joined: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 5378
Location: Indiana, U
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 10:54 am Post subject: |
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I agree with Ron Paul's views on withdrawing from foreign affairs. The US has a massive ass ego that seems to think the world would crumble without us.
| Quote: | Deuce: try world war one and two, I'm sure you've heard of those.
The definition of a great power is exactly the fact that it mingles in foreign affairs.
The thing is, whenever there is an interantion crisis the US is needed to solve the problem, simply because they're the only ones capable of doing so. The only other ones that have the economic capacity to do so are japan (which is obliged to have a small milatery) or the EU (which can't put an army together). |
case and point. Idiots like him cloud are better judgments. The truth is, if we were remotely smart we'd start focusing more on ourselves. Put some damn money into alternate fuel sources as to cut our oil dependencies. As it stands, non-us automotive companies strive to invest and switch to alternate fuel sources but simply lack the ability because the US won't help. If we put even half the money into switching from oil to ethanol as we put into the entire Iraq War. Then we'd be there by now. But sadly Bush is an idiot.
If we would cut ourselves from oil, the us's general interest in the international stage most likely would epically drop.
Its these things that make support Ron Paul, but sadly I won't vote for him. Mostly cause I still believe that major issues in our "free" country are things like abortion/gay marriage/stem cell research. All which Paul stands quietly against and all which I have to deny him my vote for. |
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center425
Joined: 06 May 2006
Posts: 366
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:35 am Post subject: |
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I want to make one thing clear, when I said with draw from the international stage I meant withdrawing from the UN and closing many trade agreements. Obv the wars are wrong and Ron Paul is right in wanted to end those. However, he wants to do MUCH MUCH more than that and I can't agree with that. WW2 pretty much proved that you can not withdraw from the world without awful things happening.
As for getting rid of excess government, for Ron Paul that includes the FDA, social welfare progarms, medicare. I can't agree with these policys. I agree with him on privacy issues but that is about it. |
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BusDriver
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 132
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:37 am Post subject: |
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Ethanol isn't going to be able to replace oil.
Thing is oil is only a part of the story, the US even has substantial oil fields themselves, unlike for example Japan or EU.
Trade is extremely relevant here. Without it economies simply crash.
US foreign involvement has also had some very good results (Balkan).
Withdrawing into your own shell also hurts a countries prestige a lot, which has both political and economical consequences that are not desirable.
Not to mention from a moral point of view it is horrible not to help people in need. Darfur for example really shows how easy it is for rich countries to close their eyes. People simply feel more compassion for a little kid getting run over on the other side of the country. |
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Craze
Joined: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 5378
Location: Indiana, U
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 11:59 am Post subject: |
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| BusDriver wrote: | Ethanol isn't going to be able to replace oil.
Thing is oil is only a part of the story, the US even has substantial oil fields themselves, unlike for example Japan or EU.
Trade is extremely relevant here. Without it economies simply crash.
US foreign involvement has also had some very good results (Balkan).
Withdrawing into your own shell also hurts a countries prestige a lot, which has both political and economical consequences that are not desirable.
Not to mention from a moral point of view it is horrible not to help people in need. Darfur for example really shows how easy it is for rich countries to close their eyes. People simply feel more compassion for a little kid getting run over on the other side of the country. |
well obviously you can't get rid of trading with other countries. But we could make ourselves ALOT more independent as one of our biggest crutches is in fact oil. And Ethanol is very capable of replacing oil. We have far more stocks of it and unlike oil it can be grown. The mere reason we haven't switched is because the mere task of switching an entire countries main fuel source is insane. With everything from gas stations to being able to afford newer more cleaner versions of cars.
Experts say that if the US government would take a damn stand and actually help, we could be oil free in 10 years. But because they won't it could take 20-30 years just for foreign automobile companies to be able to make an affordable non-oil dependent car.
Also, who the hell are we too judge the needs of other countries. Its like fucking Iraq, we should of never gone in and now that we have the entire country is wasting money as no one can decide wtf to do over there. It's ridiculous. I'd like to point out that we haven't received military support in this country since the Revolutionary War. And bam were this damn successful. If we can do it everyone else can too. We need to take a stand and pull out of foreign conflicts that outside our interference wouldn't have much of a direct impact on us. Were not the world police and its about time our leaders discover our country needs their focus far more then others do. |
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kokusho6
Joined: 10 Jul 2005
Posts: 83
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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| whats wrong with ron paul is he blames us for 9/11....and if we pull out of iraq and these countries do u think that everything is just ganna stay the same...u think if we got out of france and germany that they wouldnt start goin at it i do....but we would be nieve"spelling" to think if we just pulled out of just say the middle east that they wouldnt follow us, there will be a ton more terrorist attacks here in america |
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Craze
Joined: 30 Jan 2005
Posts: 5378
Location: Indiana, U
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| Posted: Sat Jan 12, 2008 12:42 pm Post subject: |
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| kokusho6 wrote: | | whats wrong with ron paul is he blames us for 9/11....and if we pull out of iraq and these countries do u think that everything is just ganna stay the same...u think if we got out of france and germany that they wouldnt start goin at it i do....but we would be nieve"spelling" to think if we just pulled out of just say the middle east that they wouldnt follow us, there will be a ton more terrorist attacks here in america |
Thats just stupid. The thing about Germany/France in WW2 was that WW2 was a winnable war. But Vietnam and now Iraq aren't. We can't stay there forever, and their not even close to being able to do shit themselves, else our troops could slowly withdraw. Yet we keep sending more and more in. 2 weeks ago A group was sent from the Hoosier dome in Indiana, the largest group to go overseas since WW2. So as we pump more of our blood into keeping their charade of democracy going, our country slowly continues into a down spiral.
As for your ludicrous statement about how if we withdrew, our terrorist attack rate would double. I'd like to point out that the terrorist groups we are "defending" Iraq from had nothing to do with 9/11. And that thanks to the excessive dept we've put ourselves into from united defense, a another 9/11 isn't conceivable and won't be for decades. The bush administration has made this country so paranoid of terrorist attacks that are biggest threat isn't from the poor ass terrorists across the seas but from our own citizens. Ever see the tv show Jericho? Thats more likely to happen then another 9/11. And I'm not saying that will ever be conceivable either. |
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