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Suggestion: "Non-Elimination" Tournaments



 
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snarles2



Joined: 07 Sep 2007
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:57 am    Post subject: Suggestion: "Non-Elimination" Tournaments Reply with quote

There's a way to modify the standard 8-man single elimination tournament so that everyone plays three rounds.

The end result is the same as what you get from a standard 8-man tournament, but instead of just a 1st place and 2nd place you will also have 3rd-8th place results.

Here's how:

1) Everybody starts at 8th place
2) Each round, randomly pair players who are tied in place
3) Winning the first round moves you up 4 places
4) Winning the second round moves you up 2 place
5) Winning the third round moves you up 1 place
6) Ties are determined by coin flips
7) At the end of three rounds, no two players will have the same place. You will have one first-place winner, one second-place player, etc.

The only end difference between this type of tournament and the single elimination tournament is that you will have a definite 1st-8th place, instead of 1st, 2nd, 3/4 tied, 5/6/7/8 tied.

Here's a diagram:



Advantages
1) More bang for the buck when hosting minis. Instead of providing a maximum 14 league matches per mini, you will provide 3 league matches per player per mini, or 24 league matches total
2) You can have differing prizes for 1st place, 2nd place, etc.
3) The structure also tends to pair up evenly matched decks

Disadvantages
1) Obviously, there will have to be some recoding, and it might not be worth the effort on the part of the coders
2) More complicated to understand for participants and hosts
3) Contestants might not care about fighting over 7th or 8th place, and won't always bother with playing all 3 rounds.

Thoughts?
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Dutchmojo



Joined: 28 Dec 2006
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

great idea, i hate it when i lose the first round and thats it, especially with draft minis.
would like to see it implemented.

(nicely explained with the brackets and all)
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DESTRUCTOR



Joined: 28 Jun 2005
Posts: 119

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

well many people plays on minis to test a deck so only playing 1 round really doesnt help so playing the 3 rounds may be a little betther and gives more chances to gain some teams points to those that plays only or mainlly for that reason so i think is a good idea, talk to webmasters on that
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AlexTrebek



Joined: 24 Nov 2004
Posts: 148

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If anyone drops, it ruins the entire thing. It works at FNM because you're already there and might as well play/you can lose round 1 and still get the 3rd place prize. But for tournaments with no prize, there doesn't seem to be a point.

EDIT: And your bracket doesn't benefit anyone. Example: I lose to round 1 opponent who finishes first but can still only get 5th (same as with single elimination)


Last edited by AlexTrebek on Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
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snarles2



Joined: 07 Sep 2007
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AlexTrebek wrote:
If anyone drops, it ruins the entire thing. It works at FNM because you're already there and might as well play/you can lose round 1 and still get the 3rd place prize. But for tournaments with no prize, there doesn't seem to be a point.


Well, if you're just looking for league matches you don't need a prize -- being able to get some games is good enough.


Last edited by snarles2 on Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:30 pm; edited 1 time in total
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AlexTrebek



Joined: 24 Nov 2004
Posts: 148

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So sign up for another tournament?
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snarles2



Joined: 07 Sep 2007
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AlexTrebek wrote:
So sign up for another tournament?


Then you have to find a host and draft all over again... Wink

I've only played draft so far, so I can imagine that it might not be a problem on the constructed side of the fence. But around here it can sometimes take a while to get a game going.


Last edited by snarles2 on Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:33 pm; edited 1 time in total
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AlexTrebek



Joined: 24 Nov 2004
Posts: 148

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess for drafts it works.. but your brackets have someone who is 1-2 getting 4th and someone going 2-1 5th so I think you need to switch those.
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snarles2



Joined: 07 Sep 2007
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AlexTrebek wrote:
I guess for drafts it works.. but your brackets have someone who is 1-2 getting 4th and someone going 2-1 5th so I think you need to switch those.


This way, if all but one of the Round 1 losers leave, you won't end up with the remaining guy in 3rd place. And so on.
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BALLA_STATUS



Joined: 19 Jan 2007
Posts: 67

PostPosted: Sun Sep 30, 2007 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

uh, yeah, i think if we were going to implement non-elim, we would use swiss. it would be much easier to program than that and actually works
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snarles2



Joined: 07 Sep 2007
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 4:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gushatog wrote:
uh, yeah, i think if we were going to implement non-elim, we would use swiss. it would be much easier to program than that and actually works


If we could get a Swiss system, I'd be all for that too.

The advantages of this system are that it is identical to our current setup in regards to determining #1 and #2, and in my opinion is simpler.
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FlyingFreak



Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 191
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I like the current single elemination system !
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HHH1



Joined: 10 Apr 2007
Posts: 35

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 7:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rotstejn wrote:
I like the current single elemination system !
I agree
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snarles2



Joined: 07 Sep 2007
Posts: 15

PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2007 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rotstejn wrote:
I like the current single elemination system !


If you only care about whether or not you win or get #2, the system I'm proposing is identical to the current system.
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