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Slivers to be banned in Legacy Tribal?



 
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Z_E_R_O



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:08 pm    Post subject: Slivers to be banned in Legacy Tribal? Reply with quote

I cannot find the tribal thread, but to my knowledge, the following tribes are banned in Legacy Tribal.

- Goblins

- Elves

- Zombies


What I don't understand, is how Slivers is not on that list when Zombies are. Slivers (UW Countersliver aka "Meathooks) is an actual viable Tier 2 Legacy aggro-control deck. Zombies and elves. . . Those are Tier 3 (at best) and below reserved almost exclusively for the kitchen table, so how are Elves and Zombies on the list when Slivers are not?
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seb_



Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 53

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

elves are also at least tier2 (since you can modify the bg poacher to fit the 20/60).

but yes, slivers HAVE to be banned since they are just to strong
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GoneBananas
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Posts: 329

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think they shouldn't be banned and zero is just annoyed cause i beat him with slivers. They arent that good...
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seb_



Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 53

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pls give us at least one reason why a deck that is viable in normal legacy shouldn't be banned from a "fun" format?


ps: I wasn't beaten once by slivers since i run them always by myself
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GoneBananas
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Posts: 329

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Because it is fun to pwn people with slivers Smile
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Magx



Joined: 07 Sep 2004
Posts: 452

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think is Zero is in his "red week" Wink
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ebbitten



Joined: 01 Jan 2007
Posts: 41

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Zombies is kinda questionable (too easy to build a deck?) i hold them about on par with wizards/clerics. but slivers should be banned hands down, Countersliver can hold its own against pretty much any legacy deck, so a definate no to a "fun-format".
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Eldariel
Level 3 Judge


Joined: 15 Jun 2006
Posts: 277

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been having Tribal Legacy-tournaments with Slivers banned and I've gotten not one bit of negative feedback on it. Not only is the tribe nuts against other creature-decks and benefit hugely of the restrictions of the format and have an insane amount of überpowerful 2-drops, but it also generates the most boring mirror-matches known to man and takes aeons to boot (and is horribly luck-based since basically the only thing you can strive for is drawing two more Slivers than your opponent and make them all big enough to kill in one hit since the retaliation is lethal if you go on the offensive without the kill). So yea, Slivers obviously need to be banned. The bigger question is if Wizards, Humans and Clerics deserve the same treatment too, but that remains to be seen. I'll see how the alternate format functions, I'll start having tournaments in it soon.
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Meatwarz



Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 95

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The thing is, the Tribal and usual formats are quite different, which means that good deck in a usual format isn't supposed to be as good in Tribal.

I'am not sure about Slivers, but in a usual Legacy they play "Treshold style" - cheap cantips, free counterspells, StPs, while this strategy is usually good against combo and control decks..not being something special against aggro decks (which Tribal is filled with).

Well, i may be wrong.

P.S.
Eldariel explained it Rolling Eyes
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mufl0n



Joined: 30 Jul 2006
Posts: 61

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Magx is always in his "red week".
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kobisjeruk



Joined: 04 Jun 2007
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i'm with the assumption that slivers are unofficially banned (just like Goblin Mob are unofficially banned in Precons War) so i only play in a tourney that specifically ban slivers like Eldariel's. and yes, speaking from experience, Slivers vs slivers is as boring as it could get especially if any one guy have hibernation or crystalline sliver. its really annoying.

and considering zombies, while they were never really a threat (how could you tell?*) i think they deserve the spot since no other tribe can recur their biggest threat every turn (i'm refering to gempalm polluter as uncounterable life loss source + cantrip) with unholy grotto and/or volrath's stronghold. And with Lord of the Undead? Man, this is one tribe that will never stays dead.


* trust me, i've played with/against them and they are really powerful, maybe not as powerful as goblins but they are on par with elves and slivers, at least.
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zero



Joined: 23 Sep 2004
Posts: 78

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 9:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Tird_Ape wrote:
I think they shouldn't be banned and zero is just annoyed cause i beat him with slivers. They arent that good...


just a question, this is for me?
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Z_E_R_O



Joined: 26 Jul 2006
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zero wrote:
Tird_Ape wrote:
I think they shouldn't be banned and zero is just annoyed cause i beat him with slivers. They arent that good...


just a question, this is for me?


No, he's talking about me.

Anyways, no I'm not annoyed because you beat me, I was annoyed because I mulled to 3 game 2 Very Happy. Anyways, even if I did win, I'd still be advocating its banning anyways because it IS that good for several reasons.

1.) People can play a direct legacy port that is actually competitive in Legacy (which should just not happen in an Other format), just like you did. I was able to tell you did because you registered your deck with a sideboard and everything, http://www.magic-league.com/tournament/info.php?id=34408&view=decks

2.) It's a VERY CONSISTENT aggro-control deck that has cheap counterspells and a fairly quick clock in a format an Other format, the format that is supposed to be more laid back and fun. I'm not saying that aggro-control shouldn't exist in Legacy Tribal, but not one as powerful / consistent / resilient as counter slivers.

3.) The mirror is absolute balls, I think that is something nobody would want to go through while playing in an Other format.


4.) The deck packs alot of cheap disrutpion and cantrips. The format is full of wacky combo decks (examples being Angel Reanimator / Zubera Altar / Human Salvager's Combo) that pack little to no disruption, and the ones that do pack it has no real card engine like Counter Slivers does. Not only that, but Counter Slivers plays more efficient creatures than any of those decks and can dig through their deck to find answers such as Swords to Plowshares or Force of Will / Daze faster than most combo decks can dig for their combo pieces.

To sum everything up, Counter Slivers is a deck that should not be able to exist in Legacy Tribal for it is a dominant deck in a format that doesn't have room for hate in their deck (not to mention not having a sideboard). It's a consistent aggro-control deck that most tribes cannot compete against consistently and the only ones that probably can are banned. Tribe wise, Slivers is up there with Goblins / Elves / Zombies and should be officially banned from Legacy Tribal.
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Ownj00



Joined: 27 Apr 2005
Posts: 88

PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

seriously, ban slivers, unban zombies. it just makes sense.
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