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Eldritch moon draft 1 8-4


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Grok



Joined: 08 Feb 2015
Posts: 138

PostPosted: Tue Aug 23, 2016 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

EMN draft has an equivalent amount of self-mill synergy. There's literally an entire mechanic based on it called Delirium. Many cards become bombs once you have it, like Topplegeist. Other cards essentially have flashback, like Sanitarium Skeleton and Geistblast. Putting them into your graveyard is like drawing an extra card.

Incidental effects that give you a body and put cards in your graveyard are as good in this format, if not better, than they were in Khans. The fact that Sinister Concoction gives you a Madness outlet AND can basically give you Delirium by itself all while killing any creature is what makes it an amazing card.

I don't even know why I have to say this.
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radioactivez



Joined: 14 Aug 2015
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

there are better ways to get delirium. The way you are suggesting this to just mill yourself over and over hoping to finally get it. I suggest you build the deck better include some artifact people or easy to sac artifacts and you balance your spells between sorceries and instants. A correctly built deck should be able to get delirium very easily without reducing card quality. Sinister concoction is too many hopes because if you are using it for 1 thing the other 2 will bite you in the butt. There is no way to draft a deck where all 3 parts of this card work out for you. Also you see this card in pack 3 only by this time you should have better tools already.
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GreenBear



Joined: 27 Jul 2010
Posts: 900

PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2016 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

radioactivez wrote:
there are better ways to get delirium. The way you are suggesting this to just mill yourself over and over hoping to finally get it. I suggest you build the deck better include some artifact people or easy to sac artifacts and you balance your spells between sorceries and instants. A correctly built deck should be able to get delirium very easily without reducing card quality. Sinister concoction is too many hopes because if you are using it for 1 thing the other 2 will bite you in the butt. There is no way to draft a deck where all 3 parts of this card work out for you. Also you see this card in pack 3 only by this time you should have better tools already.


You remind me of a once friend of mine aka, who became convinced another friend of mine who was being slandered on facebook, by an unknown person (it turned out to be his then boyfriend who was a bit mental) calling for him to be killed for making Islamophobic jokes (the boyfriend himself had posted) and being gay.

After playing to many murder mystery games on facebook, he became convinced this unknown person attacking my friend was in fact my friend himself trying to make people feel sorry for him. He would argue with me about it till he was blue in the face using terrible flawed logic, believing all the time he was coming across like a total genius and winning the argument, when in fact he sounded like a trump sized moron.

He ended the friendship with me because I kept calling him an idiot. He also refused to accept paul pogba was a good footballer player, he was a man utd fan, I support Juve. I'm dying to know what he is saying on that topic now man utd have resigned him for 110 million euros record breaking transfer fee. LOL
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radioactivez



Joined: 14 Aug 2015
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2016 9:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ok let's be clear on a few things. 1) I am not reading anything before i post this so if it seems weird I apologize. I thought about what was said and here is a Draft I did Yesterday this was a 6 round draft. I do not remember all the picks and such as it was real life but I do have my deck and some insights.

Rise from the tides
terrarion
ghostly wings
nagging thoughts x2
laboratory brute
borrowed malevolence
take inventory x3
curious homunculus x2
crow of dark tidings
haunted dead
just the wind x2
gerotesque mutation
olivia's dragoon
wretched gryff
lamplight of selhoff
gavony unhallowed
boon of emrakul
ingenious skabb
gisa and geralf
gisela, the broken blade

westvale abbey
plains x2
island x8
swamp x6

Now I opened the Gisa pack 1 and I figured if I was ever going to draft u/b Zombies this was the way to start. So I took it. I got passed the haunted dead and decided right there that I was all in on this or bust. Did I take bad zombies? yes. I had 2 wailing deads in my pool by the end of pack 1. Would I have played them? I would have registered them in my deck and calmly dropped from the event. I only took them as a Last resort. I opened Gisela pack 2 and I actually needed her for another deck so I took her over the Advanced stitchwing (who I would have ran) I ended that pack with my 3 take inventories. All through the draft I was hunting for cemetery recruits but saw none (found out later that the guy next to me opened lilly pack 1 and was taking them all pack 2 he had 2 of them. Pack 3 I opened the abbey and took it mainly because its a good card and I figured i may be able to use it. I was wrong as I never mad a single token with it, infact I only played it once in 6 rounds, I milled it more.
Now I know you are asking why did I run the double white splash. or maybe you counted the cards and wondered why i was running 42 in the main deck. Both questions have the Same answer. I literally did not care. The deck looked Awful in my eyes and I figured I would roll with it, and go for broke. I had 3 takes and 2 nagging, 1 piece of fix. so I figured WTH. what was the worse that could happen, i could lose more games? I already intended on a round 2 0/2 drop to do another draft. I went 6-0 I only lost 1 game to a mono red deck that cae out fast. I was mana screwed 2 games and I still won them both via the haunted dead coming back and the fact that most of my deck required very little mana. Gisela, graced my board in game 1 of the first round on 4 with the fix..then I saw her again in round 4 and tossed her before finally drawing the second plains, she only got cast twice in the whole thing but that was fine. more often she was chucked to bring back haunted dead. The curious guys were amazing as they flipped very easily and took care of business. the MVP had to be dead though as that card was insane. Yes i casted Gisa every time I saw her which was many and yes I recasted people from the yard usally haunted and the 3/5 once actually crows. Yes I casted crows a bunch, I even sacked him a few times for the emerge guy . I know beloved malevolence is not that good but I mainly used the -1/-1 side to kill weaklings and to blowout people. Only 1 game did I get ery low on my library and that was because was milling it down for more triggers off the Rise I was holding in my hand. I wanted atleast 7 Zombies so i played crows from hand, saced it and then recasted in the same turn to chump block with it. milling a bunch and leaving me only 4 cards in deck. I ended that game with no library.
Mainly I am posting this to say no matter what I type about cards being bad and such I myself will take them and if I am unable to upgrade them, I will run them in my deck. I thankfully did not have to stoop to that level.
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GreenBear



Joined: 27 Jul 2010
Posts: 900

PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2016 9:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your going to lose more games to bad mana, with that awful splash than anything else. I'd sooner have run wailing ghoul, and be able to cast my spells, than give myself an awful mana base, to play a card I'm realistically never going to be able to cast.
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radioactivez



Joined: 14 Aug 2015
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2016 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i only ran her because i already knew i was going to win no games, Also if you read I did have bad mana a few games but never because of lack of white, it was more i had to dig for black. And I won all my rounds. If I had played ghoul i would have been forced to scoop game 1 round 1 and leave.
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GreenBear



Joined: 27 Jul 2010
Posts: 900

PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2016 10:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

But your deck would have been better if you played ghoul.
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radioactivez



Joined: 14 Aug 2015
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2016 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

my deck would have been worse as it was already trash, but atleast it was not insulting. TBH not sure how the damn thing won just good skills i assume
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GreenBear



Joined: 27 Jul 2010
Posts: 900

PostPosted: Thu Aug 25, 2016 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That mana base, is more insulting than a wailing ghoul, if you play mana that bad in draft you deserve to lose every game to mana issues.
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radioactivez



Joined: 14 Aug 2015
Posts: 270

PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2016 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Greenbear, all we will do is bicker like old married people. I will never weaken my standards to play garbage like wailing ghoul and still try to win. You say the mana base is a wreck. well, let's look at it shall we?

Occurrences of blue in spells: 15
Occurrences of Black in spells: 8
Occurrences of White in spells: 2
spells that do not care : 1

So I need more blue than anything. Hence why I went with 8 islands
Black I do not need much and to be frank I can manage on just 1 swamp in play at a time. The white I need them both so they are a little tricky sure. I only played the white because as far as I was concerned I was already out due to running crow and the simple fact that my main focus of the deck was to find haunted and abuse him. I will admit that abbey was kinda greedy and probably should have been a swamp. Even without Gisela I would not have ran a ghoul, I was 42 cards so obviously i could have cut 2 cards. I always no matter what except in Zendikar formats run 17 lands no more or less so I kept to that. The color balance is not so bad seeing as my black is very small and at the latest I would like a swamp by turn 5. I can live the rest of the game on islands no problems. I won all my rounds so It worked. Even my curve dictates that black is needed by turn 4 since most of my black cards are 4 or higher or just combat tricks/removal which gets played anytime. As long as I see 2 islands in my starting 7 and something to do for turns 2 and 3 I kept the hand. Normally that was a curious or a take inventory or a just the wind, or something. I did mull to 6 twice. I do not mull past that. Did I walk into each game expecting to lose? yes. because I felt my deck lacked removal and would mill away its playables every chance it got. Yet every game was the same, Find haunted dead, assemble flyers, flip curious if he is still alive, proceed to turn things sideways and win. I only used rise twice once for 4 and the other time I already told you about.
What you seem unable to see past is this simple fact. I expected all my games to be lost, but I had a chance. If I had ran ghoul. I would not have had any chance, and been forced to conceded and leave the event. So I turned my focus on and played hard. Did I have fun, No. because my deck was trash and the games were washes. I just took my prize and that was that. Now I understand that your standards are different, you would have played both ghouls and focused hard and probably had fun even, some people can do that. They can insult the opponent into submission and enjoy those wins. I am not one of them. I do not hold any anger for you or them I just do not see the point in that.
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GreenBear



Joined: 27 Jul 2010
Posts: 900

PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2016 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm just gonna leave this now, because just like with aka this could go on forever.
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jwebber



Joined: 06 Sep 2015
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Sat Aug 27, 2016 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi GreenBear, thanks for posting. Here is my take on your draft. The first column is your pick, then my pick, with other considerations.

Pack Pick# Your Pick My Pick Considerations
1 1 Mindbender Mindbender Brazen Wolves, Kessig Prowler

Great open Smile

1 2 Captive Foul Emissary Spreading Flames, Skaab, Lurker

I love the Foul Emissary here, as a fodder for Emerge and to dig for your first pick bomb.

1 3 Griff Elite Spontaneous Mutation

I like the Elite here, as you know you'll be black, and it's excellent. I don't see the need to speculate in the 3rd color yet.

1 4 Scutler Dragoons Tanglewolf

I like the 2 drops dragoons here, as you are solid in black, and not speculating. You don't want another black drafter, and you have cut off all the black. Tanglewolf is also a strong consideration.

1 5 Maniac It of Horrid Primal Druid

I like the "It" here - good synergy with the Emissary and Elite

1 6 Maniac Prey Upon Rise, Foulbloods, Creeper

Prey Upon tells me Green is likely open. It's a good fit with the heavy creature theme so far.

1 7 Fortune Favor Graf Rats Lab Brute

Sticking with the Rats here as an early drop. Probably won't make the cut, but more fodder for the Emerge and Graveyard theme.

1 8 Maniac Survivalists Convolute, Weirded

Wow, 8th pick Survivalists, green is open here.

1 9 Mantle Wolf Bond Shield

Bond probably won't make the cut, but it might be good in certain matchups.

1 10 Ghoul Bloodbraid Creeper, Woodcutter Grit

Like the Bloodbraid here, synergy with emerge.

1 11 Borrowed Malev Borrowed Malev

I'm solidly in GB pack 2, where you had UB. So it's hard to predict what you'd see in pack 2. You didn't see much black, which may be because the black cards you passed.

In terms of pack 2, I'll assume instead that you did go UB and offer opinions on those picks you made assuming the UB (not GB):

2 1 Boon Boon Arlin, Collect Def, Unsub, Certain Death, Midnight Scav, Cultist, Brute
2 2 Unsubstantiate Unsubstantiate Cemetary Recruit, Foulbloods, Prey
2 3 Drownyard Drownyard Prey, Grapple, Foulboods, Spontaneous, H Champion
2 4 Skaab Skaab Favor, Fogwalker, Geist
2 5 Griff Griff Bloodbriar, Borrowed Malev, Brute

I'm on board with the first five picks. Sad to see those Red bombs in the open, but red was never an option. Sad to see no black passed though... I think Foulbloods is very close on pick 2, as you want lots of creatures in this build. I start to differ now though:

2 6 Rats Ghoul C Restraints

I like the Ghoul here. You have Scutler to return stuff, and may need Delirium. Seems stronger than a random 2/1, and you are unlikely to table the Scavengers. You want the dude to survive, so you can drop t4 griff...

2 7 Convolute Griff Weirded, Grapple

The 3rd Griff is great here. You can't have too many, and you can hard cast. I like Weirded Vampire here more than Convolute too as there are many madness items in Shadows, and it's another body. But then I would have also had the Dragoons Smile.

2 8 Cultist Cultist Shield, Rats, Ghoul

Not the Cultist didn't wheel - it was pick 8.

2 9 Scavengers Scavengers Brute

Scavengers did wheel, which is surprising (someone took Certain Death over it).

2 10 H Offering Convolute Make Mischief

Here you can get a Convolute over a trash rare (is that Cat Pack brew playable at all?). Much rather have a Griff or Weirded Vamp over that 7th pick Convolute.

2 11 Crop Sigil Displace

Displace can bounce Maniac and Scavengers for value. I doubt it would make the cut, but could be a SB, especially if you have other Come into Play stuff.

3 1 Wicker Witch Wicker Witch Mysteries, Courier, Logger, Grot Mutation
3 2 Concoction Throttle Apprentice, Logger

Throttle is tempting with the Scutler and you have no Madness cards. This is close. For GB, I go with the Concoction, with Bloodbriar and Weirded Vampire synergy Smile

3 3 M Compulsion M Compulsion Necropod, Rise Tides
3 4 Gargoyle Gargoyle Nagging, Farborg R, Q Wolf
3 5 Pale Rider Pale Rider Conf Unknown, Watcher Web
3 6 Sleuth Sleuth Dire Swine, Moonlit Hunt, Wolfpack Resurge
3 7 Anguish Unmaking Stallion Grot Mutation, Stalion

I don't get this pick. Was it a rare draft? Is that card worth any tickets? Seems either of the other cards is a better fit.

Very interesting to see the power level of the green in the last pack. I think Green/Black would have been a stronger deck. I don't think your deck was that great, but you have strong play skill and made up for it's weaknesses. Congrats on winning the draft Smile
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GreenBear



Joined: 27 Jul 2010
Posts: 900

PostPosted: Sun Aug 28, 2016 5:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi thanks, for the interesting feedback. Looking back over the draft i think you were correct in identifying green as open. However I also think blue was super open more so than black and if anything i should have ended up blue green, its just a question of if i want to give up such a powerful first pick.

1 2 now i think the pick is between lurker and emissary i agree with what we have opened should have been emissary

1, 3 is where we differ i think griff is the clear pick here

1 4-9 clearly show both blue green are open, were going to have to pass a lot of green the green cards though as the blue ones are more what were looking for, with what we already have an emerge plan.

1 10 bloodbriar is so much better than anything else in this pack and i think at this point there is no argument my second colour should have been green.
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