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Metamorph and Swords


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XMechaShivaX



Joined: 29 Jun 2008
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 7:34 pm    Post subject: Metamorph and Swords Reply with quote

if i target a 1/1 creature that's equipped with SOF does the metamorph become a 3/3 pro black and green
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Cableguy



Joined: 22 Oct 2010
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

no
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moscowdemon
Level 4 Judge


Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Posts: 297

PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First of all, you don't target anything.
Secondly, the metamorph will become a copy of the CARD. You could literally go over to a photocopy machine and make a copy of the card metamorph is becoming and place it in the sleeve over the metamorph.

So, unless the 1/1 has the ability "If ~ is an artifact, it gets +2/+2 and has protection from black and green" or similar written on the card, no, it won't get any bonuses etc.

Hope this helped. Usually the photocopier way describes it best. Smile
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feamar



Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 18

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 2:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not targeting?

I've had many a discussion over this, could some judge maybe give some clarity on whether or not it is targeting?
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arcannys



Joined: 11 Aug 2010
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Metamorph's ability does not target.
Copies in magic generaly only apply on the printable parts of the card. Which means you'll only get to copy whats printed on the 1/1 regardless of the outside bonuses it might have.
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xJudicatorx



Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 696

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

feamar wrote:
Not targeting?

I've had many a discussion over this, could some judge maybe give some clarity on whether or not it is targeting?


To put it simply, unless the word "target" is in the ability, it does not target. Cards which copy or do something specific without targetting will usually say "choose", "any", or "of your choice" instead.
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Gracco



Joined: 29 Mar 2010
Posts: 69

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

We kill generals with lightning greaves equipped in EDH with metamorphs. Copy does not target in this situation.
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arcannys



Joined: 11 Aug 2010
Posts: 29

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The ability that metamorph uses to "copy" a crature is an "As it comes into play" ability (similar to meddling mage or pithing needle), which mean u choose what to copy before its actually in play.
There are no targets involved. Once metamorph resolves, its controller chooses a valid obect to copy, and this action cannot be responded by any player since is part of the resolution of the spell.
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feamar



Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 18

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 8:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

xJudicatorx wrote:
feamar wrote:
Not targeting?

I've had many a discussion over this, could some judge maybe give some clarity on whether or not it is targeting?


To put it simply, unless the word "target" is in the ability, it does not target. Cards which copy or do something specific without targetting will usually say "choose", "any", or "of your choice" instead.


So, a metamorph can be used to kill for instance Thrun The last troll?
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Hardtrack



Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 651

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

feamar wrote:
So, a metamorph can be used to kill for instance Thrun The last troll?

Correct.
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feamar



Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 18

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

arcannys wrote:
The ability that metamorph uses to "copy" a crature is an "As it comes into play" ability (similar to meddling mage or pithing needle), which mean u choose what to copy before its actually in play.
There are no targets involved. Once metamorph resolves, its controller chooses a valid obect to copy, and this action cannot be responded by any player since is part of the resolution of the spell.


So, what about when I cast an Iona, shield of emeria, and choose white cause my opponent is on mono white. Can he she kill it using STP of PTE? I mean in ANY way?
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sc4rs



Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 859

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

feamar wrote:

So, what about when I cast an Iona, shield of emeria, and choose white cause my opponent is on mono white. Can he she kill it using STP of PTE? I mean in ANY way?


No. As Iona is entering the battlefield, the color is chosen. By the time Iona is on the battlefield and a valid target for STP or PTE, white spells cannot be cast by your opponent. Your opponent could Mana Tithe Iona while it is still on the stack, but once it becomes a permanent, they can no longer cast white spells.
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feamar



Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 18

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 11:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sc4rs wrote:
feamar wrote:

So, what about when I cast an Iona, shield of emeria, and choose white cause my opponent is on mono white. Can he she kill it using STP of PTE? I mean in ANY way?


No. As Iona is entering the battlefield, the color is chosen. By the time Iona is on the battlefield and a valid target for STP or PTE, white spells cannot be cast by your opponent. Your opponent could Mana Tithe Iona while it is still on the stack, but once it becomes a permanent, they can no longer cast white spells.


This is interesting, I believe a judge called that it COULD in fact be PTE'd...
I wonder what the Magic League judges think about that, did my local judge (DCI sanctioned judge, and pro tour player) make a mistake there ?
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Hardtrack



Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Posts: 651

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, he made a mistake. There is no time when Iona is on the field without having a colour chosen for her.
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Kookie_Mnstr



Joined: 09 Feb 2010
Posts: 85

PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 1:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

correct me if i'm wrong but i'm pretty sure you can respond to the ETB ability. because i've had a magic league judge tell me that a player can lightning bolt in response to tidehollow sculler's ETB ability, killing the creature, but they are still showing their hands.
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