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Spine of Ish Sah


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Davis



Joined: 06 Jun 2009
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 4:40 am    Post subject: Spine of Ish Sah Reply with quote

Hi, I've been dicking around with casual decks in standard format and I really like this deck alot:

---->Land<----
4 x Phyrexia's Core
4 x Darkslick Shores
4 x Island
3 x Swamp
2 x Drowned Catacomb

---->Creatures<----
2 x Phyrexian Ingester
2 x Massacre Wurm
1 x Sphinx of Jwar Isle
1 x Chancellor of the Dross
1 x Blightsteel Colossus

---->Other Spells<----
4 x Mycosynth Wellspring
4 x Ichor Wellspring
4 x Spine of Ish Sah
4 x Everflowing Chalice
4 x Semblance Anvil
3 x Sphere of the Suns
3 x Prototype Portal
3 x Voltaic Key
3 x Black Sun's Zenith
3 x Negate
1 x Psychic Barrier


How It Works:

A single Semblance Anvil will allow most of your artifacts to be played for free, and help you bulk up Everflowing Chalice.

Mycosynth Wellspring and Ichor Wellspring will allow you to quickly move through your deck and get to the goodie, especially when helped along by a Phyrexia's Core

Prototype Portal is really kind of a filler card, I don't know what else to put there; however, it works great when imprinted with a Voltaic Key so that you can get the most out of Everflowing Chalice.


Anyway, a dream game would be playing 3 of any land by Turn Three and setting up a Semblance Anvil, then putting down a Phyrexia's core on Turn Four and playing Everflowing Chalice kicked x3, a Voltaic Key, and double tapping the Chalice to lay down Spine of Ish Sah.


Ways to Improve the Deck:

Since it doesn't have a mass of creatures, switching out the 3 Prototype Portal for 3 Dismember or Go for the Throat, so that you can stay alive longer.

Other than that, it's not really a tier one deck. If you can get the right draws, and they get the wrong draws though, it will really piss off a good tier one net-decker.


Well, later days!
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:40 am    Post subject: Re: Spine of Ish Sah Reply with quote

Davis wrote:


A single Semblance Anvil will allow most of your artifacts to be played for free, and help you bulk up Everflowing Chalice.



Here is a problem with this statement. Chalice's cost is 0, so the Anvil cannot reduce its cost anymore. MultiKicker is an additional cost and not apart of the casting cost.

So, this will not work. The rest of your deck is solid though. but I would make a few changes:

you need Throne of Geth, it proliferates helping out your chalices and suns and will allow you to abuse the Spine and Wellsprings

In order to achieve this I would take out negate to add in three Thrones.

I would also lose the Psychic Barrier, the one Sphinx and the Prototype portals for 3 Tezzeret and two little jace.

I would also trade the 1 chancellor for the Jin-Gitixais, Core Augur, which is a better game winner in this deck, maybe even two if you can find room, I would drop the Ingesters and have 3 Massacre Wurms, 2 Jin-gitixais, and 2 blightsteel (or 1 blightsteel and one Sheolred).

that would give you more finishers. The problem with this deck is that most people run artifact hate maindeck and alot of it SB. Which means you will be getting 2-1ed for Anvil alot.
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Davis



Joined: 06 Jun 2009
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 9:42 am    Post subject: Re: Spine of Ish Sah Reply with quote

MassO wrote:


Here is a problem with this statement. Chalice's cost is 0, so the Anvil cannot reduce its cost anymore. MultiKicker is an additional cost and not apart of the casting cost.



Whoa, brotha, don't limit yourself just for the heck of it. Here, I will give you a link to quench your Thirst for Knowledge: Semblance Anvil on Gatherer

You're right about getting two-for-onned. I've seen alot of Leonin Relic Warder, Viridian Shaman and Manic Vandal running around, but not a whole lot of no-shit spells, so the solution might be a simple a s Torpor Orb.

Into the Roil and Steel Sabotage will both ruin my day. Steel Sabotage, along with other counter spells are a real "You lose" to this deck. I don't know how many effects a typical blue deck runs, but with only 7 creatures, I threw those Negates in there to be lifelines for that.


So here's the deal, I think you are right about running more artifact sacrifice effects, more Blightsteel, and I had never even considered Jin-gitixais, Core Augur. So I'm gonna try it out. I'll letya know how it goes.
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DuCK



Joined: 04 Mar 2005
Posts: 45

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Semblance Anvil works nicely with everflowing chalice because you add additional costs such as kicker, then subtract reductions.
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DuCK wrote:
Semblance Anvil works nicely with everflowing chalice because you add additional costs such as kicker, then subtract reductions.


Kickers are not costs, they are additional costs.
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Spine of Ish Sah Reply with quote

Davis wrote:
MassO wrote:


Here is a problem with this statement. Chalice's cost is 0, so the Anvil cannot reduce its cost anymore. MultiKicker is an additional cost and not apart of the casting cost.



Whoa, brotha, don't limit yourself just for the heck of it. Here, I will give you a link to quench your Thirst for Knowledge: Semblance Anvil on Gatherer

You're right about getting two-for-onned. I've seen alot of Leonin Relic Warder, Viridian Shaman and Manic Vandal running around, but not a whole lot of no-shit spells, so the solution might be a simple a s Torpor Orb.

Into the Roil and Steel Sabotage will both ruin my day. Steel Sabotage, along with other counter spells are a real "You lose" to this deck. I don't know how many effects a typical blue deck runs, but with only 7 creatures, I threw those Negates in there to be lifelines for that.


So here's the deal, I think you are right about running more artifact sacrifice effects, more Blightsteel, and I had never even considered Jin-gitixais, Core Augur. So I'm gonna try it out. I'll letya know how it goes.


You must have spent alot of time looking that link up, seeing that it only links to the card and no rulings of the card.

Still, Everflowing chalice's casting cost is 0, if you have an anvil in play and cast the Chalice, at the time that the spell is cast you can choose to activate the additional cost of the Multikicker, however, that is not apart of the casting cost which the Anvil will reduce, so you do not gain a free counter on Chalice just for having anvil in play.

the multikicker is an additional cost, which is separate from casting cost. unlike say, Fling where there is an additional cost but it is not optional, in order to play Fling you must sacrifice a creature.

the casting cost of 0 is paid when you announce the spell and pay that cost and announce what your additional cost for the multikicker will be, the casting cost is paid first, then then any additional cost that you announced is paid separately.

the way you state that multikicker works is that it affects the casting cost, which since it is optional, the controller of that card can determine the value of the multikicker making its casting cost whatever you want it to be......So, you are basically stating that I can erratic explosion a Everflowing Chalice and deal infinite damage to a player. Turn two death.....this however, doesn't work just like your anvil/chalice doesnt work.
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

DuCK wrote:
Semblance Anvil works nicely with everflowing chalice because you add additional costs such as kicker, then subtract reductions.


Reductions are subtracted when you cast the spell not after additional cost are announced.

by the rules: Cast Chalice for 0, anvil reduces it to 0 because there is no negatives in magic, then the additional cost are added.

sorry but it doesn't work.
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DuCK



Joined: 04 Mar 2005
Posts: 45

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No, i mean it reduces by 2 once. You announce spell, pay costs and additional costs, then apply reduction. If you want to play chalice for 1 and have a semblance anvil in play you don't have to pay any mana for it because 0+2-2 = 0.
It's all over the forums. Here's a link to one:

http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75842/25991713/?pg=last
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Semblance Anvil takes the total cost to cast a spell into account, not just its mana cost. This includes additional costs (such as kicker) and alternative costs (such as evoke). It also includes cost increases from other sources (such as Lodestone Golem's ability).

From the Gatherer

Wow, Duck has pwned us.
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DuCK



Joined: 04 Mar 2005
Posts: 45

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Insert guile theme.
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Davis



Joined: 06 Jun 2009
Posts: 27

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 11:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah it works, it says so in the link btw. You just gotta hit "Display Rulings". It was a good argument, though.

Anyway I don't really like the blue praetor. It reminds me of Forced Fruition, and people use that to make you lose.

I do like the Throne though, it really really helps out with Chalice and conserving your valuable colored mana.

Anyway here's a new-improved decklist (in MWS format) that has come from a little testing:

// Deck file for Magic Workstation (http://www.magicworkstation.com)

// Lands
4 [NPH] Phyrexia's Core
3 [MBS] Swamp (2)
4 [NPH] Island (1)
2 [M11] Drowned Catacomb
4 [SOM] Darkslick Shores

// Creatures
3 [WWK] Lodestone Golem
2 [MBS] Blightsteel Colossus

// Spells
3 [M11] Voltaic Key
2 [SOM] Turn Aside
3 [SOM] Throne of Geth
2 [SOM] Stoic Rebuttal
4 [MBS] Spine of Ish Sah
2 [MBS] Sphere of the Suns
4 [SOM] Semblance Anvil
3 [MBS] Black Sun's Zenith
3 [M11] Negate
4 [NPH] Mycosynth Wellspring
4 [MBS] Ichor Wellspring
4 [WWK] Everflowing Chalice

The 'meta' that I am playing is MTGO Casual rooms. Sometimes you run into netdeckers that forfeit after 1 hand, but I'm really just playing for the CASUAL format. Whatev.


My newest consideration in this deck is:

Is Semblance Anvil really all that great?
It's obviously necessary to drop a Spine on Turn 4, but if this deck doesn't hit the Semblance Anvil, then it wouldn't it just be better suited runing Karn, Liberated [instead of Spine]?

Black mana is only there for Black Sun's Zenith.




Edit -

This deck is old to me now and not really that fun anymore. I think the previous version was better than this. Either way, I don't think it's going anywhere. Thanks,
-Davis
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 8:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think for T2 it is too, clunky and doesn't quite work, however for MBS block , this would be something to consider because you only lose a total of 10 cards.

Chalice, Key and 2 of the lands. To combat that loss, you add 3 tezzeret, agent of bolas, and 2 vensers. Add two basic land in replace of the rare land you lose.

so the deck should resemble this:

4 [NPH] Phyrexia's Core
6 [MBS] Swamp (2)
9 [NPH] Island (1)
4 [SOM] Darkslick Shores

23 land

// Creatures
2 [SOM] Massacre Wurm
2 [MBS] Blightsteel Colossus
2 [SOM] Consecrated Sphinx

// Spells


3 [SOM] Throne of Gethl
4 [MBS] Spine of Ish Sah
3 [MBS] Sphere of the Suns
4 [SOM] Semblance Anvil
2 [MBS] Black Sun's Zenith
3 [NPH] Mycosynth Wellspring
4 [MBS] Ichor Wellspring
3 [NPH] Tezzeret's Gambit
3 [MBS] Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2 [MBS] Venser, the Sojourner

SB:

4 [SOM] Turn Aside

I know Turn aside will definitely be in the Board, and probably dismember as well, but I really haven't play tested this so I will have to get back to this once I have time to next week, finals suck. And sb additions would be helpful. thanks
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sc4rs



Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 859

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MassO wrote:
I think for T2 it is too, clunky and doesn't quite work, however for MBS block , this would be something to consider because you only lose a total of 10 cards.

Chalice, Key and 2 of the lands. To combat that loss, you add 3 tezzeret, agent of bolas, and 2 vensers. Add two basic land in replace of the rare land you lose.

so the deck should resemble this:

4 [NPH] Phyrexia's Core
6 [MBS] Swamp (2)
9 [NPH] Island (1)
4 [SOM] Darkslick Shores

23 land

// Creatures
2 [SOM] Massacre Wurm
2 [MBS] Blightsteel Colossus
2 [SOM] Consecrated Sphinx

// Spells


3 [SOM] Throne of Gethl
4 [MBS] Spine of Ish Sah
3 [MBS] Sphere of the Suns
4 [SOM] Semblance Anvil
2 [MBS] Black Sun's Zenith
3 [NPH] Mycosynth Wellspring
4 [MBS] Ichor Wellspring
3 [NPH] Tezzeret's Gambit
3 [MBS] Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2 [MBS] Venser, the Sojourner

SB:

4 [SOM] Turn Aside

I know Turn aside will definitely be in the Board, and probably dismember as well, but I really haven't play tested this so I will have to get back to this once I have time to next week, finals suck. And sb additions would be helpful. thanks


Gonna be awfully hard to play Venser, the Sojourner with no white sources besides Sphere of the Suns. xD
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sc4rs wrote:
MassO wrote:
I think for T2 it is too, clunky and doesn't quite work, however for MBS block , this would be something to consider because you only lose a total of 10 cards.

Chalice, Key and 2 of the lands. To combat that loss, you add 3 tezzeret, agent of bolas, and 2 vensers. Add two basic land in replace of the rare land you lose.

so the deck should resemble this:

4 [NPH] Phyrexia's Core
6 [MBS] Swamp (2)
9 [NPH] Island (1)
4 [SOM] Darkslick Shores

23 land

// Creatures
2 [SOM] Massacre Wurm
2 [MBS] Blightsteel Colossus
2 [SOM] Consecrated Sphinx

// Spells


3 [SOM] Throne of Gethl
4 [MBS] Spine of Ish Sah
3 [MBS] Sphere of the Suns
4 [SOM] Semblance Anvil
2 [MBS] Black Sun's Zenith
3 [NPH] Mycosynth Wellspring
4 [MBS] Ichor Wellspring
3 [NPH] Tezzeret's Gambit
3 [MBS] Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
2 [MBS] Venser, the Sojourner

SB:

4 [SOM] Turn Aside

I know Turn aside will definitely be in the Board, and probably dismember as well, but I really haven't play tested this so I will have to get back to this once I have time to next week, finals suck. And sb additions would be helpful. thanks


Gonna be awfully hard to play Venser, the Sojourner with no white sources besides Sphere of the Suns. xD


-1 Swamp +1 Plains. 6 sources of white should be more than enough for 2 Vensers.
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

yea thanx, scars....I didn't even realize it until i was testing, but i do have suns, so i will do as Appleman, stated above.
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