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Molten-Tail Masticore



 
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Mr_Fudo



Joined: 03 Jun 2010
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 12:06 pm    Post subject: Molten-Tail Masticore Reply with quote

hi guys, someone can explain me some teach? i seen that masticore is most used in monored side
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In Mono Red, it's almost useless. Typically, it can be used as a means of creature control, also as a 4/4 body for 4, which is always good. Unfortunately, SOM block means lots of artifact hate, so he isn't very useful at this point and I don't see him getting played to very much in the future.
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 5:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Molten-tail Masticore is great when you have an engine to not only keep cards in your had but to feed the grave and have mana to use his abilities.

That being said, using him in a GU ramp deck with Consecrated Sphinx, Frosty, Primeval titan, harrow, and Lead the stampede to add more cards in hand or graveyard.

JTmS was its best friend because of the card advantage, now that is gone. playing a ramp deck gives the Masticore more mana to do its thing while keeping cards in your hand and creatures in your graveyard.
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dv8r



Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 239

PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ummm, there seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding here from the posters above...

red decks play masticore because
a) it is colourless, so kills kore firewalker
b) it is a powerful finisher for 4 mana (red aggro decks like to have powerful cards vs other aggro decks and the mirror, but cannot really afford to pay 6 mana for titans)
c) it is a repeatable source of damage (reach), this means that you can trade creatures and this guy will convert your graveyard into another resource to win with. masticore will win the game by itself vs other aggro decks which cannot race him (he can hit for 8 a turn), cannot kill him (he regenerates) and cannot outsize him (the only creatures played that are bigger are titans, and he can trade with a titan with a regen +shot, or even 2 shots. he also kills baloth in one shot
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dv8r wrote:
ummm, there seems to be a fundamental misunderstanding here from the posters above...

red decks play masticore because
a) it is colourless, so kills kore firewalker
b) it is a powerful finisher for 4 mana (red aggro decks like to have powerful cards vs other aggro decks and the mirror, but cannot really afford to pay 6 mana for titans)
c) it is a repeatable source of damage (reach), this means that you can trade creatures and this guy will convert your graveyard into another resource to win with. masticore will win the game by itself vs other aggro decks which cannot race him (he can hit for 8 a turn), cannot kill him (he regenerates) and cannot outsize him (the only creatures played that are bigger are titans, and he can trade with a titan with a regen +shot, or even 2 shots. he also kills baloth in one shot


Kor Firewalker is a good point, but what about the quickness of emptying your hand, which most red decks seem to do. Seems like he would be a good sb option if you wanted to side out Koth for a few games.
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

By turn 4, you have only 1 or two cards in hand, with only 4 mana on the field. That is not enough to sustain his set backs, since there is no card advantage in MonoRed.

Now if you were to play Howling Mines along with him, that would grant you freedom to play a card a turn, activate his abilities and not allow him to die during your upkeep.

Another problem with him in MonoRed is that he is clunky, mana extensive. turn 4 you play him, then you are using all your mana to activate his abilities each turn, and since you are already at 1 to 2 cards in your hand you cannot play more lands, and as soon as you activate this burn ability someone will doom blade him.
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 6:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stucco wrote:
MassO wrote:
By turn 4, you have only 1 or two cards in hand, with only 4 mana on the field. That is not enough to sustain his set backs, since there is no card advantage in MonoRed.

Now if you were to play Howling Mines along with him, that would grant you freedom to play a card a turn, activate his abilities and not allow him to die during your upkeep.

Another problem with him in MonoRed is that he is clunky, mana extensive. turn 4 you play him, then you are using all your mana to activate his abilities each turn, and since you are already at 1 to 2 cards in your hand you cannot play more lands, and as soon as you activate this burn ability someone will doom blade him.


Sounds pretty bad... except that monored in standard isn't a straight burn deck. The removal will be applicable to the earlier threats just as much as Molten-tail Masticore. It also adds consistency to the late game, when red is in top-deck mode. Mid-late game red doesn't exactly need lands, it needs to end the game. Throwing away a mountain is fine when you are hitting your opponent in the head for 4 damage.


Problem is Stucco, Masticore makes you discard before you draw, so have fun trying to keep Masticore alive with one card in hand. You will more often than not, be deciding to keep a spell in your hand or keep Masticore alive. lets say you have only 4 lands but you have drawn a Koth do you play the koth knowing that you can attack for 8 but next turn Masticore dies and your left swinging for 4 which is what masticore was doing anyways. He is to vulnerable to black which is prominent at the moment.

And don't try saying that well I'll just hold cards in my hand, because in that case you lose anyway because MonoRed is suppose to be dropping 2 spells a turn to over run its opponents. If you slow down, you will play right into control and they will take over.
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darkwizard42
Level 2 Judge


Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow MassO you are a fool...what card would you rather keep in your hand over a guaranteed 4 damage. He isn't clunky in Mono Red he is a perfect top end threat to compliment Koth. The fat body with regeneration provides a great beatstick and blocker. This card is great at getting rid of pesky threats and should a red deck falter and not kill by turn 6 this guy gives you phenomenal reach. I have no idea where you are getting your absurd logic...
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

darkwizard42 wrote:
Wow MassO you are a fool...what card would you rather keep in your hand over a guaranteed 4 damage. He isn't clunky in Mono Red he is a perfect top end threat to compliment Koth. The fat body with regeneration provides a great beatstick and blocker. This card is great at getting rid of pesky threats and should a red deck falter and not kill by turn 6 this guy gives you phenomenal reach. I have no idea where you are getting your absurd logic...


He is definitely not a 4-of. The thing is, once you use his ability, unless you have regen mana open, he's dead. Artifact removal can get him, creature removal can get him (except Go For The Throat, which, besides Lightning Bolt, is probably the most played removal in Type 2 right now and definitely the most played in SOM Block). Needless to say, he is better in a control deck rather than a red deck. And if you need Masticore to get you your wins, then you're building your decks wrong, since RDW should kill by turn 5.
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MassO



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

darkwizard42 wrote:
Wow MassO you are a fool...what card would you rather keep in your hand over a guaranteed 4 damage. He isn't clunky in Mono Red he is a perfect top end threat to compliment Koth. The fat body with regeneration provides a great beatstick and blocker. This card is great at getting rid of pesky threats and should a red deck falter and not kill by turn 6 this guy gives you phenomenal reach. I have no idea where you are getting your absurd logic...


I guess I get my "absurd logic" from the fact that I have play tested him in monored and even a green/blue aggro deck and I have to say he works totally better when you can do both accel for land and gain card advantage through draw spells/abilities.

There has been several times playing monored, especially against Valakut or Vamps, that I was stuck on 4 land and a Masticore in play and had to discard a koth or Kudothra in order to keep him, just to have him doom bladed, beast within, naturalized, nature's claimed or acidic slimed. yes, i respond by regening him, which also taps him so i don't get to attack or use his ability.

Valakut, usually wins the next possible turn, or if it is UW control, my oppon will wait til i discard a card to the masticore then into the roil him, leaving me with only the Masticore in hand and basically gaining an extra turn in the process. Like I said, if there was a way to gain card advantage in monored then i could see it, but since there are more options right now I don't see it.

Molten-steel Dragon gives you a 4/4 flier for 4, kudothra gives you a hasty 4/4 flier for 5, and hero of oxid ridge a 4/2 with battlecry and evasivness, which are all better options and quicker damage.
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JeZeus



Joined: 05 Sep 2004
Posts: 225

PostPosted: Thu Jun 30, 2011 11:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Masticore is a great 2slot for any t2 red sideboard. It is colorless dmg you can do every turn. . . . that kills things with protection from red. . . it kills Deceiver as well. . It regenerates . . . It swings for four . . . Honestly man. . . You use his ability end of turn . . . worst case they dump tons of spells trying to kill it. . . The only thing that makes him 'less' awesome is Shrine of Burning rage which can kill those pesky protection creatures.

On another note, why the heck would anyone sideboard Masticore against Valakut? Why would that be relevant in this discussion what so ever??? Seriously, just because it is not good against Valakut does not mean it is not good. You would probably sideboard Mark of Mutiny and or Ruinblaster's if you got them. Sheesh.
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darkwizard42
Level 2 Judge


Joined: 02 Sep 2005
Posts: 260

PostPosted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MassO it looks like you brought in Masticore and played it in AWFUL circumstances. If you try to argue that he is better in a GU deck with Howling Mine I'm pretty sure you know nothing about magic. Why would you ever bring this guy in against valakut...and he died to doom blade? What kind of board position are you at anyway if he still has doom blades and you have an empty hand. You do realize you can masticore instead of discarding -__- which means if Koth is more relevant in the situation let molten-tail die...

You just don't seem to get how the card is to be used. It's not a mainboard card. It's not a 4-of but it is certainly a decent mirror threat or way to get great reach against other decks...
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