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Why 2nd main phase?



 
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boeda



Joined: 21 Dec 2007
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:12 pm    Post subject: Why 2nd main phase? Reply with quote

Okay, I really need clarification on this one:

Its my opps. turn, he edges, strips, wastes or simply destroys my land;
I tap it for lets say blue(obv. for my powerful spellpierce, force spike, spell snare, dispel or whatever counter you like);
He knows Im playing counters so he wants to empty my pool by going to 2nd mainphase WITHOUT having any creatures to declare as attackers;
He plays his spell in 2nd mainphase and laughs his ass off.

But why?

Whats the use for an attack phase if you dont declare any attackers? Simply a way of getting rid of a mana source?

I know its the way its played but why is it legal?

Thanks in advance,

The Wizard of Why
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Kaz



Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pretty much as you stated. Since he destroyed your land in the first main phase, and you drained it for mana, it forces you to use it for an instant, or lose it. After it's lost, he's got more of an option to do things he wants to do. The second main phase is basically set up so that you can have tricks or a bluff during the combat phase, and then if you don't use them cast more things during the 2nd main phase (the way I always saw it at least). Just because there's no creatures on the board doesn't mean you skip the combat phase, every turn you always go through every phase barring something that says you don't (Stasis and Time Stop for examples).
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Delicious



Joined: 08 Jun 2007
Posts: 883

PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I dont understand why you would think anything is wrong.

Going through the steps is part of magic
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gypsy



Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1671

PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

you float mana, he passes you priority, you dont use the mana so your mana pool empties, the turn goes to the next step/phase which is combat, there are no creatures to attack so it skips to his 2nd mainphase.
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magicman85



Joined: 22 Aug 2009
Posts: 555

PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

... I guess I'll answer that when you can answer why the upkeep step is after the untap step.
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Conkisstador



Joined: 08 Sep 2004
Posts: 543

PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2011 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Going through the steps of magic is Magic. In your scenario where we don't need a 2nd mainphase... it'd set up a string of if A then B rules that all needed implementation. It's better to simply have a pattern for everything to follow.

Uses of the 2nd main phase:
-Able to play ManaDrain without needing to use the mana same turn.
-Play a Flameborn Hellion that can block
-Getting around their floated mana
-Playing cards post-combat to not reveal info
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Farseer
Level 3 Judge


Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 335

PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2011 8:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Why 2nd main phase? Reply with quote

boeda wrote:
Whats the use for an attack phase if you dont declare any attackers? Simply a way of getting rid of a mana source?

I know its the way its played but why is it legal?


It is legal because *every* phase takes place *every* turn.

Comprehensive Rulebook wrote:
5. Turn Structure

500. General

500.1. A turn consists of five phases, in this order: beginning, precombat main, combat, postcombat main, and ending. Each of these phases takes place every turn, even if nothing happens during the phase. The beginning, combat, and ending phases are further broken down into steps, which proceed in order.


(Clariax'd)


Last edited by Farseer on Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:08 am; edited 3 times in total
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boeda



Joined: 21 Dec 2007
Posts: 159

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks Farseer, thats what I wanted to see. To me its not very rational to have a combat phase without any possible combat, but I didnt make the rules...

I've played magic since Revised (the 1st set to be published in the Netherlands) and back in those days me and my friends went to a bar or coffeeshop and played multiplayer or drafts all night.

We had those small rule-books that came with a starterbox but if we had any rule-problems these were discussed by the group and then we just went with the best solution. We all became great debaters but when I started to play tournaments most of our 'own' rules washed away.

Why am I telling you this? I still have this twist when I play games that I need to understand WHY the rules are as they are. This combatphase rule still doesnt feel right to me and I'm sure I could've convinced my playgroup back then=)

Ah well, thanks for all the responses, Im gonna ponder a bit more on the decks we played back then...
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urafever



Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 2:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This has basically been answered, but if you are looking for some kind of "reason" here, it is simply because the game state can become very complex. It is entirely possible that you'll move to the combat step and someone will want to use an ability or play a spell in that step -- just because attackers weren't declared doesn't mean the step is skipped.
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