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Windbrisk and Emrakul



 
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Bande



Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 39

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:23 am    Post subject: Windbrisk and Emrakul Reply with quote

If Emrakul is hiding under Windbrisk and it then comes into play do you get the time walk effect? Is "play" in this case the same or different than "cast"?
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gypsy



Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1671

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

you get the extra turn
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thedarkness



Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 580

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Play is now cast. Windbrisk Heights was printed before that errata, but the long and short of it is yes, you do get the extra turn because "play" is now "cast" on the errata'd version of Windbrisk Heights' text.

If it specified being "cast from your hand" or some such, then no, you wouldn't get it.
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Farseer
Level 3 Judge


Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 335

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Play
1. To play a land is to put a land onto the battlefield as a special action. See rule 115, “Special Actions,” and rule 305, “Lands.”
2. To play a card is to play that card as a land or cast that card as a spell, whichever is appropriate. See rule 601, “Casting Spells.”


Play = "Cast as a spell".

When you cast Emrakul, take an extra turn after this one.


Quote:
Play is now cast. Windbrisk Heights was printed before that errata, [...] "play" is now "cast" on the errata'd version of Windbrisk Heights' text.


That is not correct.

Windbrisk Heights says play. You could remove Dryad Arbor. You "play" Dryad Arbor. You do not "cast" it.


Card Name: Windbrisk Heights
Types: Land
Card Text:
Hideaway (This land enters the battlefield tapped. When it does, look at the top four cards of your library, exile one face down, then put the rest on the bottom of your library.)
Tap: Add White to your mana pool.
White, Tap: You may play the exiled card without paying its mana cost if you attacked with three or more creatures this turn.


Last edited by Farseer on Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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thedarkness



Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 580

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I meant that they are now synonymous. Yes, the rule specifies that you play lands and cast spells, but all nonland cards that were printed using the word play for abilities like that one have been errata'd accordingly.

Edit: OH I C WAT U DID THAR.

Yeah, so you play the spell. But that still triggers the ability as if you had cast it because of the OH FUCK THIS EXPLAINING WHAT I MEANT THING YOU GOT THE ANSWER ALREADY lol.

Re-edit: also, Emrakul doesn't have an enters the battlefield ability, hence the confusion surrounding this question. o_o
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Clariax
Level 3 Judge


Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 174

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There's no "as if you had cast it." You do cast it. The word 'play' is used on Windbrisk Heights' and other similar abilities when the card it's telling you to play may be a land or may be a nonland. "Cast" is used specifically for spells only. As Farseer quoted, the word "play" in the ability refers to definition 2 of "Play" in the glossary.

thedarkness wrote:
I meant that they are now synonymous. Yes, the rule specifies that you play lands and cast spells, but all nonland cards that were printed using the word play for abilities like that one have been errata'd accordingly.

Edit: OH I C WAT U DID THAR.

Yeah, so you play the spell. But that still triggers the ability as if you had cast it because of the OH FUCK THIS EXPLAINING WHAT I MEANT THING YOU GOT THE ANSWER ALREADY lol.

Re-edit: also, Emrakul doesn't have an enters the battlefield ability, hence the confusion surrounding this question. o_o
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thedarkness



Joined: 13 Jul 2006
Posts: 580

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clariax wrote:
There's no "as if you had cast it." You do cast it. The word 'play' is used on Windbrisk Heights' and other similar abilities when the card it's telling you to play may be a land or may be a nonland. "Cast" is used specifically for spells only. As Farseer quoted, the word "play" in the ability refers to definition 2 of "Play" in the glossary.

thedarkness wrote:
I meant that they are now synonymous. Yes, the rule specifies that you play lands and cast spells, but all nonland cards that were printed using the word play for abilities like that one have been errata'd accordingly.

Edit: OH I C WAT U DID THAR.

Yeah, so you play the spell. But that still triggers the ability as if you had cast it because of the OH FUCK THIS EXPLAINING WHAT I MEANT THING YOU GOT THE ANSWER ALREADY lol.

Re-edit: also, Emrakul doesn't have an enters the battlefield ability, hence the confusion surrounding this question. o_o
It seems to me that this change caused more confusion than it prevented.

Also, why was I quoted at the end of that last comment? o.o

Edit: Also also, am I to understand that in order to play a spell, you must cast it, which is why the Emrakul's when you cast ability still triggers? Because I've gotta be honest, I don't see any answer to this guy's question that is accompanied by pertinent explanations.

Gypsy didn't explain at all, I explained badly, and...reading the other replies I am just as mystified as I was before, even though I'm almost positive that the ability still triggers.

EDIT IN BIG BOLD SCRATCH MARKS. NEVERMIND, I JUST MISSED THE 1. IN THE COPYPASTA FROM THE GLOSSARY.

In case that doesn't make anything clearer, what happened was that I just saw the bolded and underlined bits and totally missed their context because it was not bolded and underlined and I am a squirrel today.
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Alandariel



Joined: 17 Jan 2006
Posts: 217

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@thedarkness

Any card can be "played". When a card is "played", if it is a spell it is "cast". Any time you "cast" a spell you are "playing" that card. Understand?

Also, a spell doesn't have to be a card to be "played" (or, "cast"). Copies of spells are not cards, but are still objects.

If a land card is "played", it is put directly onto the battlefield and you receive priority again afterwards if you are the active player.

Understand? It's simple, really, when you think about it.

If I'm wrong here, please correct me. I'm still studying for next judges test reset. Razz
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Farseer
Level 3 Judge


Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 335

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alandariel wrote:
Any card can be "played".


Evermind.

Cards without mana costs cannot be played.



Alandariel wrote:
Also, a spell doesn't have to be a card to be "played" (or, "cast"). Copies of spells are not cards, but are still objects.


Spells are not "cards".

Quote:
Card
The standard component of the game: a Magic card with a Magic card front and a Magic card back. Cards may be traditional or nontraditional. Tokens aren’t considered cards. In the text of spells or abilities, the term “card” is used only to refer to a card that’s not on the battlefield or on the stack, such as a creature card in a player’s hand. See rule 108, “Cards.”



Alandariel wrote:
If I'm wrong here, please correct me. I'm still studying for next judges test reset. Razz


Hope that helps.
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Alandariel



Joined: 17 Jan 2006
Posts: 217

PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Farseer wrote:
Alandariel wrote:
Any card can be "played".


Evermind.

Cards without mana costs cannot be played.



Alandariel wrote:
Also, a spell doesn't have to be a card to be "played" (or, "cast"). Copies of spells are not cards, but are still objects.


Spells are not "cards".

Quote:
Card
The standard component of the game: a Magic card with a Magic card front and a Magic card back. Cards may be traditional or nontraditional. Tokens aren’t considered cards. In the text of spells or abilities, the term “card” is used only to refer to a card that’s not on the battlefield or on the stack, such as a creature card in a player’s hand. See rule 108, “Cards.”



Alandariel wrote:
If I'm wrong here, please correct me. I'm still studying for next judges test reset. Razz


Hope that helps.


Oh yeah, I read about the cards without mana costs not being able to be played. I forgot... that's why I'm studying. And probably why I failed last time. :<

Also, the terminology is where I think I'm weakest. Thanks for the help!
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Clariax
Level 3 Judge


Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 174

PostPosted: Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Farseer wrote:

Cards without mana costs cannot be played.



This is not correct. A nonexistant mana cost cannot be paid. Spells without mana costs can be cast, just need to find a way to do it that doesn't involve paying the mana cost (for example, use Windbrisk Heights).
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