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Siege-Gang Commander vs Urge to Feed



 
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[PT]



Joined: 26 Dec 2007
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 5:18 pm    Post subject: Siege-Gang Commander vs Urge to Feed Reply with quote

Hi all!

Situation: I cast Urge to Feed on the commander and tap my only creature in play, Gatekeeper of Malakir. My opponent sacs his commander only, targeting my creature.

Results: Both creatures go to graveyard or only the commander goes to gy, given that my gatekeeper is a 3/3?

Thanks for helping out!

See you on that table!
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Bantos86



Joined: 28 Nov 2009
Posts: 209

PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Both creatures die, his due to the sacrifice to Siege-Gang Comannder's ability, your due to the fact that by the time state-based actions are checked after SGC's ability resolves, it will have been dealt lethal damage and thus destroyed. Then Urge to Feed will attempt to resolve, see no target, and then hit the graveyard after doing nothing.
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gypsy



Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1671

PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 5:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gatekeeper wouldnt become a 3/3 the spell wouldnt resolve as there is no legal targets
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gypsy



Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1671

PostPosted: Mon Feb 08, 2010 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mister_gaga wrote:
Tapping a vampire for Urge to Feed happens during resolution. The Siege-Gang Commander's ability will go on the stack second, meaning it will resolve first. Thus, your gatekeeper will no longer be in play.

Ignore this next part if you're already confused: However, if you played a SECOND urge to feed in response to the commanders ability, your second urge would resolve first, allowing you to tap the gatekeeper for the second urge to feed. In this case, your vampire would live but have 2 damage on it. It would already be tapped when the original urge to feed resolved, and you could not tap it again without additional effects added to th stack.


depending if theres a target for the 2nd urge to feed
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TurinT
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 10

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 8:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The second urge to feed does resolve even if it has no legal target? I don't think so, the second urge to feed does just nothing. (except forcing the opp to sac his siege gang commander)
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Thran_Golem



Joined: 10 Jan 2009
Posts: 48

PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2010 11:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

TurinT wrote:
The second urge to feed does resolve even if it has no legal target? I don't think so, the second urge to feed does just nothing. (except forcing the opp to sac his siege gang commander)


If a spell has no legal targets, it is automatically countered. If some of its targets are now illegal, then the spell is not countered, but only acts on the remaining legal targets.

In this situation, because the only target of the original Urge to Feed (the Siege Gang Commander) is no longer in play, it is now an illegal target and the spell is countered.
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Andarel



Joined: 06 Mar 2008
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Playing a spell works like this:

1) You declare the spell and pick all applicable targets and modes
2) You pick what costs you will pay (if applicable)
3) You pay all costs
4) You put the spell onto the stack

You can do this any time you have priority, and nothing can happen while you are doing it.

So:

You declare that you are playing Urge to Feed on Siege-Gang Commander, paying its cost. Urge to Feed is put onto the stack.

Your opponent gets priority, and responds by sacrificing Siege-Gang Commander to its own ability. The stack looks like this:

TOP
[Ability] Deal 2 damage to target (targeting gatekeeper) (Source: SGC)
[Spell] Urge to feed
BOTTOM

The stack resolves from top to bottom, so the Siege-Gang Commander's ability resolves first and takes out the gatekeeper.
Urge to Feed tries to resolve, has no legal targets, and is countered.

It's worth noting that, as was mentioned earlier, tapping the creatures for Urge to Feed happens during its resolution - if the spell can't go through because its target vanished, you aren't allowed to tap anyone. If it was an additional cost (a la Kicker), you'd have to tap the guys when you cast it, and if it was countered they'd stay tapped but not get a counter.
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Andarel



Joined: 06 Mar 2008
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Fri Feb 19, 2010 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unfortunately, nope. After you play a spell, you get priority (usually, it's just passed to the opponent), then your opponent gets priority. This continues until both players pass, then things start resolving.

It works exactly the same on both players' turns.
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