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Interesting Cardpool 6xZendikar


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[R]Nchamay



Joined: 17 Jul 2008
Posts: 71

PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 2:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the RW is better too,gatekeeper is too hard to play unless you go monoblack, because if you do get it out, you generally get something useless like trosky said. RW lets you keep the pressure on bettr
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Daffie999



Joined: 08 Jun 2008
Posts: 26

PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Black is hard to ignore, but if you do... WU is the best choice imo.

2 Kor Hookmaster
2 Umbra Raptor
1 Kazandu Blademaster
1 Kabira Angel
2 Ondu Clerics
1 Kor Skyfisher
1 Kor Sanctifier
2 Shepherd of the Lost
2 Windrider Eels
1 Aether FIgment

1 Whiplash Trap
1 Into the Roil
1 Journey to Nowhere
1 Ior Ruin Expedition
1 Brace the Elements
1 Rite of Replication

1 Explorer's Scope
1 Trusty Machete

10 Plains
7 Islands

Still fast but better tempo control with Whiplash Trap and Roil, as well as better evasion with the Eels and Figment if the allies don't work. Rite is also great.
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dv8r



Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 239

PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

my build is card for card Trotsky's build except I might cut a land for bold defence or shatterskull giant (although I concede that that makes the deck less consistant)
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This certainly is an intresting card pool as the title suggested, I quite like the look of the UW build.
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P_P4E



Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 579

PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think there is room to run less than 18 lands in nearly any deck. Cut the scope and play 18?

if you play black blue with the gatekeepers, you can bounce their dudes eot and edict the good ones. You only want to play it on turn 3 if they're beating you down, but with all the removal its unlikely.
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Mirage



Joined: 31 Jan 2006
Posts: 115

PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

P_P4E wrote:
MASSIVE mistake not playing the black here. You got basically the best non-rare bomb black you could get!

2 scorps
2 crocs
1 mosquito
1 sell sword
2 lacerator
2 gatekeeper
1 ripper
1 disfig
1 end
1 MARSH

These are good cards.

berserk
short
boar
geo
giant
grunts
warlord
pyromancer
paint
cry
fire

Or

2 hookmaster
2 ondu cleric
1 skyfisher
1 sanct
1 outfitter
1 evangle
1 blademaster
2 sheperd
1 journey
1 brave

Or

2 raptor
2 eel
1 fragment
1 roil
1 expedition
1 whiplash
1 rite of replication
1 summoners bane
1 cancel even, if you need it

I actually like the blue here, because with any other colors black is just along side, but with the blue it is dominant. and with all those good double black cards that is what you want.

Trotsky...How is 2 removal almost as good as 1 end, 1 disfig, 1 MARSH, 2 edict guy, 1 mosquito? It's not, not even close. Black is the CLEAR choice here!


Don't act like you have anything better to do, finish typing the names.
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P_P4E



Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 579

PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mirage wrote:
P_P4E wrote:
MASSIVE mistake not playing the black here. You got basically the best non-rare bomb black you could get!

2 scorps
2 crocs
1 mosquito
1 sell sword
2 lacerator
2 gatekeeper
1 ripper
1 disfig
1 end
1 MARSH

These are good cards.

berserk
short
boar
geo
giant
grunts
warlord
pyromancer
paint
cry
fire

Or

2 hookmaster
2 ondu cleric
1 skyfisher
1 sanct
1 outfitter
1 evangle
1 blademaster
2 sheperd
1 journey
1 brave

Or

2 raptor
2 eel
1 fragment
1 roil
1 expedition
1 whiplash
1 rite of replication
1 summoners bane
1 cancel even, if you need it

I actually like the blue here, because with any other colors black is just along side, but with the blue it is dominant. and with all those good double black cards that is what you want.

Trotsky...How is 2 removal almost as good as 1 end, 1 disfig, 1 MARSH, 2 edict guy, 1 mosquito? It's not, not even close. Black is the CLEAR choice here!


Don't act like you have anything better to do, finish typing the names.


Thanks for adding to the discussion. You're a valued member of this community and I really appreciate you as a person.
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coolcreep



Joined: 18 Feb 2006
Posts: 588

PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

P_P4E wrote:
coolcreep wrote:
I think that WR is pretty clearly correct. Marsh casualties is a strong card, but sheperd is only slightly weaker, is less situational, and he has 2 of them. The WR deck can get board presense early, keep pressure up with hookmasters, and then when a deck has to expend all its removal to stop from being overwhelmed, you simply drop sheperd and win. The UB deck is good, but the WR one is much more explosive and consistent.


again, not at all.

Consistent in the fact that you have a handfull of creatures that do almost the same thing? People apparently are overrating this hookmaster, he's not as good as the gatekeeper AT ALL. Sheppard is auto win? It hits for 3 damage! The blue flier with landfall is about as good.

I forgot the Red had one geopeade, but even then Its a coin-toss.


Comparing windrider eel to sheppard of the lost is absolutely laughable. First strike, vigilance, and flying makes attacking effectively almost impossible for your opponent, while simultaneously providing a fast clock. When you add onto the fact that 2 toughness is about a million times easier to kill in this format than 3 toughness, its obvious that sheppard is on a different plateau than eel in terms of power. As for hookmaster, in terms of power he is obviously inferior to the gatekeeper, but you can play him on turn 3 consistently, as opposed to the gatekeeper, who is a challenge even on turn 6. The WR is fast and consistent, the UB is slow and clunky with a chance at being ridiculous. The former choice is obviously the correct one.
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P_P4E



Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 579

PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2009 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

coolcreep wrote:
P_P4E wrote:
coolcreep wrote:
I think that WR is pretty clearly correct. Marsh casualties is a strong card, but sheperd is only slightly weaker, is less situational, and he has 2 of them. The WR deck can get board presense early, keep pressure up with hookmasters, and then when a deck has to expend all its removal to stop from being overwhelmed, you simply drop sheperd and win. The UB deck is good, but the WR one is much more explosive and consistent.


again, not at all.

Consistent in the fact that you have a handfull of creatures that do almost the same thing? People apparently are overrating this hookmaster, he's not as good as the gatekeeper AT ALL. Sheppard is auto win? It hits for 3 damage! The blue flier with landfall is about as good.

I forgot the Red had one geopeade, but even then Its a coin-toss.


Comparing windrider eel to sheppard of the lost is absolutely laughable. First strike, vigilance, and flying makes attacking effectively almost impossible for your opponent, while simultaneously providing a fast clock. When you add onto the fact that 2 toughness is about a million times easier to kill in this format than 3 toughness, its obvious that sheppard is on a different plateau than eel in terms of power. As for hookmaster, in terms of power he is obviously inferior to the gatekeeper, but you can play him on turn 3 consistently, as opposed to the gatekeeper, who is a challenge even on turn 6. The WR is fast and consistent, the UB is slow and clunky with a chance at being ridiculous. The former choice is obviously the correct one.


Sheppard makes attacking almost impossible? Adventure gear on ANY creature runs through it. First Strike is a great ability EARLY in this format, but late its the same as it is in any other format, completely situational. People keep talking about gatekeeper like you cast it on 3...You almost NEVER cast it on 3. In fact, don't consider it a 3 drop, consider it a 5 drop. In the Blue Black build, you'd be playing something like 2 to 1 swamps, which should, on average, net you 3 swamps on 5.

It only takes losing 2 games to lose a match. I'd rather lose 1 game more frequently due to consistency issues than losing a match due to inferior card quality.

3, 2 for 1 removal creatures, 2 spot removal and 1 somewhat situational but potentially one sided wrath removal spell are too much to ignore...And that's just Black. With the blue you get an into the roil, whiplash, and potentially summoners bane and cancel. That's a lot of removal. And you have racing capability in the Eel's, Raptors, crocs and lacerators.
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SJM



Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 415

PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2009 8:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

W/R 100%.

I don't like forcing allies. Ondu cleric is usually bad with less than 9+ allies.

2x Shepherd is insane.

Kazuul Warlord with plenty of allies is insane.

You have enough evasion and a machete.

I think you run 18 land with this deck because you want to get to 5 ASAP for your shepherds of the lost.

I'd build it something like:

2 punishing fire
1 journey to nowhere
1 trusty machete
1 bold defense

2 shepherd of the lost
1 kazuul warlord
1 tuktuk grunts
1 bladetusk boar
1 kabira evangel
1 kazandu blademaster
1 plated geopede
1 kor skyfisher
2 kor hookmaster
1 murasa pyromancer
1 kor sanctifiers
1 highland berserker
2 shatterskull giant
1 goblin shortcutter

1 kabira crossroads
9 plains
8 mountain

Deck can apply pressure early but has plenty of late game power as well to win via ally chain.
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SJM



Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 415

PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2009 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shepherd of the lost is frickin' ridiculous.

2 of them in play is almost always gg.

1 with machete on it is also probably gg.
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