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Zen Zen Zen 4-3-2-2 draft no11.



 
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 8:33 am    Post subject: Zen Zen Zen 4-3-2-2 draft no11. Reply with quote

Back with another 4-3-2-2, I lost in finals.

Event #: 737523
Time: 11/28/2009 8:49:44 PM
Players:
bloodmoney
--> ElementalMox
Gaming Tim
semicolon
smrt bomb
TheScienceist2
dooguej
Moisez

------ ZEN ------

Pack 1 pick 1:
Teetering Peaks
Goblin Bushwhacker
Akoum Refuge
Reckless Scholar
Blood Seeker
Hedron Scrabbler
Windborne Charge
Vastwood Gorger
Feast of Blood
Lethargy Trap
Emeria, the Sky Ruin
Mountain
Mold Shambler (FOIL)
Kabira Crossroads
--> Hideous End

Nothing on the same level as the end.

Pack 1 pick 2:
Teetering Peaks
Turntimber Basilisk
Forest
Kabira Crossroads
--> Windrider Eel
Desecrated Earth
Khalni Gem
Cliff Threader
Turntimber Grove
Hagra Crocodile
Makindi Shieldmate
Caller of Gales
Mold Shambler
Akoum Refuge

The eel is the best card, I hate black blue in this format, as the decks always seem to end up being clunky control decks, but once again nothing else is on the same level.

Pack 1 pick 3:
Pillarfield Ox
Mark of Mutiny
Kor Outfitter
Electropotence
Paralyzing Grasp
--> Vines of Vastwood
Ruinous Minotaur
Bog Tatters
Spell Pierce
Sunspring Expedition
Island
Shoal Serpent
Grim Discovery

The best card is the vines, a little unhappy with how this draft is starting as i do not like blue green either and black green is not alot better but I can not realistically take a grasp 3rd

Pack 1 pick 4:
Adventuring Gear
Hagra Diabolist
Forest
Highland Berserker
Whiplash Trap
Lethargy Trap
Nissa's Chosen
Vastwood Gorger
Desecrated Earth
Quest for Ancient Secrets
--> Ęther Figment
Goblin Bushwhacker

Intresting pack, I would have taken the adventuring gear until recently, its gone down a little in my estimation, I fekt it was amazing when i first played mostly due to always drawing it turn 1, however its really disappointing turn 5 and onwards. Aether figment or whiplash trap is tough but unblockable 3/3s are right up my street.

Pack 1 pick 5:
Goblin Bushwhacker
Makindi Shieldmate
--> Crypt Ripper
Spidersilk Net
Goblin War Paint
Guul Draz Vampire
Spreading Seas
Ravenous Trap
Forest
Sejiri Refuge
Tanglesap

Looks like we are in blue black, as the ripper is by someway the best card

Pack 1 pick 6:
Ondu Cleric
Grappling Hook
Expedition Map
Forest
Runeflare Trap
Kor Cartographer
Spreading Seas
--> Guul Draz Vampire
Caravan Hurda
Seismic Shudder

Grappling hook is to slow so the vampire it is

Pack 1 pick 7:
Spire Barrage
Bold Defense
Expedition Map
Sky Ruin Drake
--> Into the Roil
Territorial Baloth
Kor Sanctifiers
Blood Tribute
Forest

Blue looks very open, into the roil is one of its better commons

Pack 1 pick 8:
Spell Pierce
Nimbus Wings
Quest for the Holy Relic
Kabira Crossroads
Relic Crush
Trapmaker's Snare
--> Vampire's Bite
Swamp

Okay

Pack 1 pick 9:
Teetering Peaks
Akoum Refuge
--> Hedron Scrabbler
Windborne Charge
Lethargy Trap
Mountain
Kabira Crossroads

Pack 1 pick 10:
Forest
--> Kabira Crossroads
Desecrated Earth
Turntimber Grove
Makindi Shieldmate
Caller of Gales

Pack 1 pick 11:
--> Kor Outfitter
Spell Pierce
Sunspring Expedition
Island
Shoal Serpent

Pack 1 pick 12:
Forest
Lethargy Trap
Desecrated Earth
--> Quest for Ancient Secrets

Pack 1 pick 13:
Spidersilk Net
--> Spreading Seas
Forest

Pack 1 pick 14:
--> Runeflare Trap
Caravan Hurda

Pack 1 pick 15:
--> Forest

------ ZEN ------

Pack 2 pick 1:
Gigantiform
Shepherd of the Lost
Oran-Rief Survivalist
Plains
Kor Hookmaster
Carnage Altar
Soaring Seacliff
Vampire's Bite
Vampire Lacerator
Trapfinder's Trick
Relic Crush
--> Gomazoa
Zendikar Farguide
Zektar Shrine Expedition
Nimbus Wings

Such a disappointing pack for us gomazoa it is

Pack 2 pick 2:
Kabira Crossroads
--> Rite of Replication
Tajuru Archer
Slaughter Cry (FOIL)
Highland Berserker
Relic Crush
Tempest Owl
Kazandu Refuge
Island
Savage Silhouette
Nimbus Wings
Spell Pierce
Mindless Null
Noble Vestige

This gives us some end game punch, I guess now I try and go control and set the deck up to survive until i can power out my haymakers

Pack 2 pick 3:
Ior Ruin Expedition
Vampire Lacerator
Paralyzing Grasp
Disfigure
--> Marsh Casualties
Kor Hookmaster
Territorial Baloth
Carnage Altar
Explorer's Scope
Cliff Threader
Gomazoa
Timbermaw Larva
Island

Very welcome addition, disfigure if the casulties was not here but begining to get a bit more opt0omistic about my deck.

Pack 2 pick 4:
Scythe Tiger
Seascape Aerialist
Vampire's Bite
Steppe Lynx
Murasa Pyromancer
Beast Hunt
--> Roil Elemental (FOIL)
Spire Barrage
Kor Outfitter
Baloth Cage Trap
Swamp
Trapfinder's Trick

Okay my deck is now superpowerfull, its just a case of surviving

Pack 2 pick 5:
--> Giant Scorpion
Kor Cartographer
Windrider Eel
Hagra Crocodile
Pitfall Trap
Plains
Tuktuk Grunts
Kabira Evangel
Merfolk Wayfinder
Sejiri Refuge
Savage Silhouette

With surviving in mind the giant scorpion is alot more attractive than the eel, who is not much of a defensive card plus blue black 4 drop swap always ends up swamped!

Pack 2 pick 6:
Seismic Shudder
Goblin War Paint
Kor Sanctifiers
Crypt Ripper
Caravan Hurda
Plains
Caller of Gales
Ravenous Trap
Tuktuk Grunts
--> Kraken Hatchling

This card also felt better in tune to survival than the more powefull crypt ripper

Pack 2 pick 7:
Steppe Lynx
Tanglesap
--> Kraken Hatchling
Turntimber Grove
Makindi Shieldmate
Expedition Map
Caravan Hurda
Seascape Aerialist
Forest

More defense

Pack 2 pick 8:
Unstable Footing
Noble Vestige
Swamp
Grim Discovery
Cancel
Beast Hunt
--> Sky Ruin Drake
Demolish

More defense

Pack 2 pick 9:
Plains
Carnage Altar
Soaring Seacliff
--> Vampire's Bite
Trapfinder's Trick
Relic Crush
Nimbus Wings

Pack 2 pick 10:
Relic Crush
Tempest Owl
Island
--> Savage Silhouette
Spell Pierce
Noble Vestige

Pack 2 pick 11:
--> Ior Ruin Expedition
Paralyzing Grasp
Carnage Altar
Cliff Threader
Island

Tough call this, I felt missing land drops would be so awfull in this deck, I already have a fair bit of removal, plus the ruin helps me draw into my power

Pack 2 pick 12:
Scythe Tiger
--> Kor Outfitter
Swamp
Trapfinder's Trick

Pack 2 pick 13:
Plains
--> Merfolk Wayfinder
Sejiri Refuge

May actualy be playable in this deck as its so blue

Pack 2 pick 14:
Plains
--> Ravenous Trap

Pack 2 pick 15:
--> Forest

------ ZEN ------

Pack 3 pick 1:
Steppe Lynx
Crypt Ripper
Ruinous Minotaur
Hideous End
Murasa Pyromancer
Baloth Cage Trap
Swamp
Bold Defense
Explorer's Scope
Soaring Seacliff
Expedition Map
--> Sphinx of Jwar Isle
Into the Roil
Seascape Aerialist
Vastwood Gorger

Could not ask for a better open, roil elemental, sphinx, rite of replication, marsh casulties, if a can control deck can win in Zen this is it.

Pack 3 pick 2:
Torch Slinger
Ęther Figment
Turntimber Grove
Quest for the Gemblades
Mountain
Makindi Shieldmate
Caller of Gales
Quest for Pure Flame
Surrakar Marauder
Desecrated Earth
Blood Seeker
Oran-Rief Recluse
Kraken Hatchling
--> Umara Raptor

Solid blue guy, like it more than maruader due to mana, figment cc

Pack 3 pick 3:
Explorer's Scope
Bold Defense
Slaughter Cry
--> Cancel
Greenweaver Druid
Magma Rift
Shieldmate's Blessing
Zendikar Farguide
Ruinous Minotaur
Island
Bog Tatters
Quest for Pure Flame
Archmage Ascension

Poor pack but okay

Pack 3 pick 4:
--> Living Tsunami
Cobra Trap (FOIL)
Narrow Escape
Spreading Seas
Mountain
Into the Roil
Stonework Puma
Magosi, the Waterveil
Goblin Shortcutter
Grazing Gladehart
Guul Draz Vampire
Shatterskull Giant

Tempted to take the into the roil as alot of the time im not going to want to play the tsunami until at least turn 6, but i resisted even if it doesnt fit the deck like a glove its still very powerfull

Pack 3 pick 5:
Kor Aeronaut
Whiplash Trap
Piranha Marsh
Plains
Kor Cartographer
--> Merfolk Seastalkers
Timbermaw Larva
Island (FOIL)
Vastwood Gorger
Harrow
Trailblazer's Boots

More awsome blue, a great mana sink

Pack 3 pick 6:
Teetering Peaks
Summoner's Bane
Sadistic Sacrament
Turntimber Grove
--> Whiplash Trap
Goblin Shortcutter
Mountain
Desecrated Earth
Mold Shambler
Narrow Escape

More solid blue

Pack 3 pick 7:
Kor Duelist
--> Turntimber Basilisk
Plains
Shieldmate's Blessing
Shoal Serpent
Graypelt Refuge
Beast Hunt
Soul Stair Expedition
Grim Discovery

Considered the grim discovery, but felt my deck did not need it whilst turntimber basilisk is not kracken hatchlings friends and im playing 2

Pack 3 pick 8:
Cancel
Magma Rift
--> Reckless Scholar
Swamp
Vastwood Gorger
Shieldmate's Blessing
Mire Blight
Zendikar Farguide

Should be very good in my bomb laden deck

Pack 3 pick 9:
--> Crypt Ripper
Swamp
Bold Defense
Explorer's Scope
Soaring Seacliff
Seascape Aerialist
Vastwood Gorger

Prob not gonna play but its the best card all the same

Pack 3 pick 10:
Turntimber Grove
Mountain
Caller of Gales
Quest for Pure Flame
Desecrated Earth
--> Kraken Hatchling

3 main deck seems a bit excessive but its a reasonable sb option

Pack 3 pick 11:
Bold Defense
Zendikar Farguide
Island
Quest for Pure Flame
--> Archmage Ascension

rare draft

Pack 3 pick 12:
Cobra Trap (FOIL)
Narrow Escape
--> Spreading Seas
Mountain

For decks with bad mana bases

Pack 3 pick 13:
Plains
--> Vastwood Gorger
Trailblazer's Boots

Pack 3 pick 14:
Turntimber Grove
--> Desecrated Earth

Pack 3 pick 15:
--> Plains

The deck

2 kraken hatchling
1 into the roil
1 ior ruin expedition
1 sprading seas
1 aether figment
1 cancel
1 hideous end
1 giant scorpion
1 gomazoa
1 merfolk wayfinder
1 reckless scholar
1 umara raptor
1 rite of replication
1 living tsunami
1 merfolk sea stalkers
1 wind rider eek
1 marsh casulties
1 whiplash trap
1 sky ruin drake
1 roil elemental
1 sphinx of the jwar isle
12 islands
6 swamp

A couple of things on the format, like other people have said I am starting to dislike it. The huge problem is how much better black and red are than the other colours. Being lucky enough to be in the right seat to end up black red is often enough to win you the draft it seems. Whilst ending up being forced into green no matter how well u draft can often mean a first round loss.

In the last 2 drafts I have ended up in finals of, have both been vs RB both decks were a thousand times better than mine though i won one due to an error by my opponent.

This time round game 1 i had 12 lands between hand and board, whilst my opponent had 6, if i had drew rite of replication I could have won due to copying his malakir but couldnt. Game 2 a blood seeker combined with bog taters stopped me from being able to play my rite for the win, the games were just total blow outs. Is Zen Zen Zen draft to imbalanced a format, Thoughts?

Feedback appreciated.
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P_P4E



Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 579

PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its imbalanced as far as "my average br deck is better than your average (enter two colors here) deck."

But I think if you have a nuts deck of other colors, its almost even to a BR nuts deck, mostly because its very difficult to get a complete nuts BR deck with so many people taking the cards. If that makes sense.

I'm very surprised people aren't taking parayzing grasp as high as I am. People play dehydrate and the like in other formats, and in this format enchantments and artifacts are at a normal, or perhaps slightly below average presence. I have no problem picking it as high as fourth. People don't ever play around it early, and Late if they do you're playing the color with arguably the most bombs in blue to draw to while they wait you out.

I think the key may be hate-drafting against red or black early and often if you're in other colors, especially green. You may end up splashing a card or two since green has a couple land-fixing options and you can decrease the overall power level of anyone playing BR while not worrying about them taking your cards as green is classically undrafted (granted for a reason). That's usually how I go about business and I do pretty well with it.
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Araeliz



Joined: 17 Nov 2007
Posts: 30

PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 4:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mmmm

Last edited by Araeliz on Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
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LordLink



Joined: 11 Oct 2007
Posts: 79

PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm curious as to why you immediately thought of U/B as a clunky control deck.

1-drop vampires, 2-drop marauders/terns is a pretty cool curve and blue is nice and easy on the colour-base. Plus evasion into scorpion usually works out nicely for racing.

But then I'd swear they simply print fewer Welkin Terns than the other commons.
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P_P4E



Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 579

PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was thinking the same thing, link. Tern is crucial for any blue based beatdown, though, and usually multiple copies.

Terns and Raptors and Eels are pretty strong against rb, usually. Blue has a good curve of fliers from 2 to 5 in the common slot. I also like kraken hatchling with the scope or gear in a somewhat aggressive manner. Blue works the best with the equipments I think as well.
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SJM



Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 415

PostPosted: Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paralyzing Grasp is great. I've never been upset to draw it, ever. It often wins games.

You should have taken the grasp for sure.

Your deck was fine. If you got "totally blown out" then hey, maybe it's because you drew 12 land and they drew 6?

I definitely would have run more than 6 swamps with hideous end and marsh casualties.

Merfolk Wayfinder is bad in your deck because you already have enough early defense between your hatchlings, into the roil, scorpion, other removal, and raptor etc.

I'd have just split 8/10 swamp/island (or 9/9 with both crypt rippers) and run a crypt ripper over the merfolk wayfinder. I'd probably run the other crypt ripper over the ior ruin expedition at that point. I'd consider cutting the wind rider eel (not great in ur deck, and definitely awful on defense) for putting the ior ruin expedition back into the deck (paralyzing grasp if you had taken it).

I like the format quite a lot for sealed. I think it's easily one of the best sealed formats I've seen in my time playing magic (since 1995), ranking right up there with Odyssey.

We'll see what the next set does. I'm sure it'll tone down the black/red dominance somewhat as it is obvious to everyone that black/red is dominant in Zen sealed and draft.
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Mon Nov 30, 2009 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If i was set into blue I would have took grasp but I wasnt I just take the best card that early. I could have picked one up later as well but took the ruin as I felt it better suited my deck. It is very good in control decks its just so rare your able to build a decent control deck in this format.

I do not like vampire lacetator, its pretty bad, so blue has 1 2 drop common, black 2 in maruader and blood seeker but marudaer and tern are both high picks so its hard to get multiples. The gruul draz vampire is good in aggro decks but in control, its going to be a vanilla 1/1 not really helpin when you need it to.

Whilst both have tons of good 4 drops sellsword, crocodile and crypt ripper are all early to mid picks in black although blue only has eel at common it has tsunami plus, seastalkers at uncommon, in this format you really do not wnat more than 4-5 4 drops and the way ub works out and how i like to draft its easy to end up with too many 4 drops.

The ruin and wayfinder were played because the deck was so mana greedy the expedition was very good through out. The wayfinder was terrible every time I played it did not hit 1 island, not playing that again. I have only 3 black spells so 6 sources is fine even if 2 are double as I do not need to play either of them early most of the time.

And yeah they better give green some fucking good creatures in the next expansion, ie low cc better stats than the other colours, as its not like they have removal or evasion or anything. Greens suppose to have the best craetures, but if you asked me what the best common creatures in this set were green would not have many candidates.
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SJM



Joined: 17 Apr 2009
Posts: 415

PostPosted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I boarded in Merfolk Wayfinder ONCE ever.

I was playing the U/B sealed in a PTQ discussed in another thread in the limited section of this board.

My opponent was W/R with a fair number of 2/1 aggro creatures I had seen in earlier games.

I had no 2 drops. None.

I had only a few 3 drops, most of which I didn't want to chump with.

I took out Hagra Diabolist for him, on the draw.

I played him and removed 2 swamps and some crap I didn't want from the top and drew into a Vampire Nighthawk.

Not bad, but that's about the only circumstance I would play Merfolk Wayfinder (on the draw, no early drops, opponent running 1 toughness creatures, deck hungry for mana).
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