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SSE draft 8-4 No3 where did it all go wrong?



 
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 6:38 pm    Post subject: SSE draft 8-4 No3 where did it all go wrong? Reply with quote

Okay this is another 8-4 draft i scrubbed out first round, help me figure out where i went wrong.

Event #: 60651
Time: 8/23/2008 1:00:58 AM
Players:
Gatormage
SteveMillersBanned
Lundstrom
--> ElementalMox
Project Xeven
OyvindN
Condamned
Jersch0r

------ SHM ------

Pack 1 pick 1:
Safehold Elite
Barkshell Blessing
Mudbrawler Raiders
Sickle Ripper
Parapet Watchers
Blight Sickle
Whimwader
Giantbaiting
Viridescent Wisps
Ashenmoor Cohort
Thornwatch Scarecrow
Raking Canopy
Beseech the Queen
--> Firespout
Sunken Ruins

Yes i first picked a non blue white or artifact card, i think its the best card here by some way.

Pack 1 pick 2:
Ballynock Cohort
--> Crabapple Cohort
Traitor's Roar
Gravelgill Duo
Torture
Fists of the Demigod
Mine Excavation
Spell Syphon
Inescapable Brute
Foxfire Oak
Splitting Headache
Reknit
Spiteflame Witch
Polluted Bonds

The ballyknock is clearly better than the crabapple but not so much that when you already have a firespout you pick it right?

Pack 1 pick 3:
Rune-Cervin Rider
--> Juvenile Gloomwidow
Sickle Ripper
Torpor Dust
Blight Sickle
Woeleecher
Prismwake Merrow
Crimson Wisps
Viridescent Wisps
Cinderbones
Moonring Island
Drove of Elves
Everlasting Torment

Looking at this now i think drove of elves is the pick but when i did this i had not had some of the feedback from you guys.

Pack 1 pick 4:
Somnomancer
Guttural Response (FOIL)
--> Æthertow
Gravelgill Axeshark
Sootstoke Kindler
Mine Excavation
Blazethorn Scarecrow
Spell Syphon
Rustrazor Butcher
Aphotic Wisps
Flow of Ideas
Impromptu Raid

No red coming maybe go GW splahing r.

Pack 1 pick 5:
Nurturer Initiate
Torture
Torpor Dust
Kithkin Shielddare
Fate Transfer
Poison the Well
--> Gleeful Sabotage
Ashenmoor Cohort
Dawnglow Infusion
Corrosive Mentor
Tattermunge Maniac

Really good in this format, good artifacts and enchantments not since mirrodin has this sort of removal been this good, well its not quite as good as it was in mirrodin but hey.

Pack 1 pick 6:
--> Faerie Macabre
Traitor's Roar
Apothecary Initiate
Whimwader
Toil to Renown
Thornwatch Scarecrow
Rustrazor Butcher
Resplendent Mentor
Wild Swing
Fracturing Gust

Im not liking these packs and Im really not sure what the pick is here do not think i made the right one though.

Pack 1 pick 7:
--> Juvenile Gloomwidow
Gravelgill Axeshark
Memory Sluice
Poison the Well
Foxfire Oak
Pili-Pala
Cinderbones
Moonring Island
Fossil Find

I would have picked the foxfire oak but you can bank on them coming later.

Pack 1 pick 8:
Disturbing Plot
Nurturer Initiate
Leechridden Swamp (FOIL)
Fate Transfer
Crimson Wisps
Toil to Renown
--> Barrenton Medic
Memory Plunder

He's okay.

Pack 1 pick 9:
Blight Sickle
Whimwader
--> Viridescent Wisps
Ashenmoor Cohort
Thornwatch Scarecrow
Raking Canopy
Beseech the Queen

These first few packs seem really weak, wisp is good though.

Pack 1 pick 10:
Torture
Mine Excavation
Spell Syphon
Inescapable Brute
--> Foxfire Oak
Splitting Headache

Told you so.

Pack 1 pick 11:
Blight Sickle
Prismwake Merrow
--> Viridescent Wisps
Cinderbones
Moonring Island

Can not complain about a wisp

Pack 1 pick 12:
Mine Excavation
--> Blazethorn Scarecrow
Spell Syphon
Aphotic Wisps

Pack 1 pick 13:
--> Nurturer Initiate
Torture
Dawnglow Infusion

In case I go aggro rather than ramp into fatty.dec

Pack 1 pick 14:
--> Apothecary Initiate
Toil to Renown

Pack 1 pick 15:
--> Cinderbones

------ SHM ------

Pack 2 pick 1:
Old Ghastbark
Merrow Wavebreakers
Scar
Mudbrawler Cohort
Raven's Run Dragoon
Chainbreaker
Hungry Spriggan
Intimidator Initiate
Elsewhere Flask
Niveous Wisps
Zealous Guardian
River's Grasp
Tatterkite
Lockjaw Snapper
--> Spawnwrithe

Can be sick if uncontested.

Pack 2 pick 2:
Medicine Runner
Kinscaer Harpoonist
Cinderhaze Wretch
Farhaven Elf
--> Scuttlemutt
Put Away
Goldenglow Moth (FOIL)
Manamorphose
Cerulean Wisps
Strip Bare
Faerie Swarm
Gloomwidow
Horde of Boggarts
Valleymaker

The valleymaker is clerly better but i need mana ramp more than fatties at the moment so i took the mutt.

Pack 2 pick 3:
Wingrattle Scarecrow
Shield of the Oversoul
Merrow Wavebreakers
Gloomlance
Boggart Arsonists
Raven's Run Dragoon
--> Hungry Spriggan
Loch Korrigan
Scrapbasket
Scuzzback Scrapper
Rite of Consumption
Gnarled Effigy
Umbral Mantle

Good cards atlast.

Pack 2 pick 4:
Sootwalkers
Puncture Bolt
Safehold Duo
Wingrattle Scarecrow
Zealous Guardian
Loch Korrigan
Ember Gale
Niveous Wisps
Loamdragger Giant
Faerie Swarm
--> Howl of the Night Pack
Cursecatcher

Now theres something to smile about.

Pack 2 pick 5:
Shield of the Oversoul
Kinscaer Harpoonist
Mudbrawler Cohort
Smash to Smithereens (FOIL)
--> Last Breath
Gloomwidow's Feast
Manaforge Cinder
Scuzzback Scrapper
Elvish Hexhunter
Goldenglow Moth
Heap Doll

Deals with witches and faeries and other such pesky creatures.

Pack 2 pick 6:
Chainbreaker
Last Breath
Sootwalkers
Blistering Dieflyn
Presence of Gond
Drowner Initiate
Scarscale Ritual
Sinking Feeling
--> Gloomwidow
Mistveil Plains

More good green alright.

Pack 2 pick 7:
Ghastly Discovery
Mountain (FOIL)
--> Morselhoarder
Elvish Hexhunter
Smash to Smithereens
Smolder Initiate
Scrapbasket
Strip Bare
Blowfly Infestation

More fat.

Pack 2 pick 8:
Consign to Dream
Oona's Gatewarden
Rite of Consumption
Bloodshed Fever
Loamdragger Giant
Put Away
--> Turn to Mist
Deepchannel Mentor

Wow that is a late consign, but a turn to mist could definatly be useful

Pack 2 pick 9:
Old Ghastbark
Mudbrawler Cohort
--> Hungry Spriggan
Elsewhere Flask
Niveous Wisps
Zealous Guardian
Lockjaw Snapper

Smile

Pack 2 pick 10:
--> Farhaven Elf
Put Away
Goldenglow Moth (FOIL)
Manamorphose
Cerulean Wisps
Gloomwidow

Oh yeah it wheeled.

Pack 2 pick 11:
Loch Korrigan
Scrapbasket
Scuzzback Scrapper
Rite of Consumption
--> Umbral Mantle

I think this card can be okay

Pack 2 pick 12:
Loch Korrigan
--> Niveous Wisps
Loamdragger Giant
Cursecatcher

Doubt im gonna play it but its best of the bunch

Pack 2 pick 13:
--> Scuzzback Scrapper
Goldenglow Moth
Heap Doll

Pack 2 pick 14:
--> Blistering Dieflyn
Sinking Feeling

Pack 2 pick 15:
--> Strip Bare

------ EVE ------

Pack 3 pick 1:
Wickerbough Elder
Nip Gwyllion
Crumbling Ashes
Trapjaw Kelpie
Merrow Bonegnawer
Duergar Assailant
Stream Hopper
Tilling Treefolk
Gilder Bairn
Aerie Ouphes
--> Figure of Destiny
Patrol Signaler (FOIL)
Gift of the Deity
Hatchet Bully
Noggle Bridgebreaker

£££££££££££££££££££££ i turn a profit before ive even played now thats talent

Pack 3 pick 2:
Clout of the Dominus
Lingering Tormentor
Idle Thoughts
Beckon Apparition
--> Monstrify
Dream Thief
Shell Skulkin
Swirling Spriggan
Smoldering Butcher
Altar Golem
Favor of the Overbeing
Fire at Will
Nightsky Mimic
Inside Out

I really need 4 drops now and although swirling spriggan would probablt have been a more sensible pick, monstify plus spawnwrithe was too sick to resist

Pack 3 pick 3:
Restless Apparition
Wilderness Hypnotist
Unmake
Quillspike
Kithkin Spellduster
Double Cleave
Talara's Bane
Woodlurker Mimic
Grazing Kelpie
--> Flame Jab
Noggle Bandit
Shorecrasher Mimic
Heartlash Cinder

Can be devistating vs some decks

Pack 3 pick 4:
Clout of the Dominus
Gwyllion Hedge-Mage
--> Rise of the Hobgoblins
Springjack Shepherd
Banishing Knack
Slippery Bogle
Hoof Skulkin
Battlegate Mimic
Harvest Gwyllion
Favor of the Overbeing
Jawbone Skulkin
Cenn's Enlistment

Rare draft.

Pack 3 pick 5:
Hobgoblin Dragoon
Oona's Grace
--> Desecrator Hag
Wickerbough Elder
Odious Trow
Merrow Levitator
Tilling Treefolk
Impelled Giant
Cinder Pyromancer
Soot Imp
Double Cleave

Is it better than the elder both seem good to me but the hag is guranted card advantage so i decided i liked it more.

Pack 3 pick 6:
Edge of the Divinity
Talara's Bane
Gift of the Deity
Dream Thief
Kithkin Zealot
Hotheaded Giant
Trapjaw Kelpie
Moonhold
--> Hag Hedge-Mage
Drain the Well

Im sure i messed up drafting green in eventide i have had little experince of doing it

Pack 3 pick 7:
Cinder Pyromancer
Merrow Bonegnawer
Hotheaded Giant
Aerie Ouphes
--> Groundling Pouncer
Scourge of the Nobilis
Noggle Hedge-Mage
Grazing Kelpie
Nip Gwyllion

More ways to deal with aerial threats good good

Pack 3 pick 8:
Batwing Brume
Edge of the Divinity
Raven's Crime
--> Monstrify
Kithkin Zealot
Nettle Sentinel
Jawbone Skulkin
Hoof Skulkin

Wow 2 monstrify, now im thinking i should have took spriggan but theres a surprise coming my way can you guess what it is yet?

Pack 3 pick 9:
Nip Gwyllion
Crumbling Ashes
Trapjaw Kelpie
Merrow Bonegnawer
Stream Hopper
Tilling Treefolk
--> Gift of the Deity

This card seems like it can win games very quicky from stalled boards etc

Pack 3 pick 10:
Clout of the Dominus
Idle Thoughts
Beckon Apparition
Shell Skulkin
--> Swirling Spriggan
Favor of the Overbeing

Surprise it came back nice!

Pack 3 pick 11:
Wilderness Hypnotist
Double Cleave
Talara's Bane
--> Woodlurker Mimic
Heartlash Cinder

Fine 2 drop in my deck i have a few gb spells

Pack 3 pick 12:
Springjack Shepherd
Slippery Bogle
--> Hoof Skulkin
Favor of the Overbeing

Seems late

Pack 3 pick 13:
--> Oona's Grace
Tilling Treefolk
Double Cleave

Also late

Pack 3 pick 14:
--> Talara's Bane
Drain the Well

Pack 3 pick 15:
--> Merrow Bonegnawer

1 Viridisent wisp
1 Groudling Pouncer
1 Gleefull Sabbotage
2 Juvenile Gloomwidow
1 Woodlurker mimic
1 Firespout
1 Scuttlemutt
1 Farhaven Elf
1 Gloomwidow
1 Hag Hedge Mage
2 Hungry Spriggan
1 Spawnwrithe
2 Monstify
1 Swirling Spriggan
1 Desocrator Hag
1 Gifts of deity
1 Crabapple Cohort3
1 Morsel Hoarder
1 Foxfire Oak
1 Howl of the night pack
15 forest
2 mountain

sb cards of note

aethertow
turn to mist
last breath

Got paired vs a mainly blue deck splashing white, won game 1 with foxfireoak beats, lost game 2 to an aerial assualt including a massive faerie swarm and a biting tether could not draw my firespout. Lost game 3 to first turn zealous guardin 3rd turn steel, i drew scuttlemutt 4th turn but ramped turn 5 into morseal horder with the intention of howling next go, he had tethers and thats all she wrote.

So what did i do wrong?
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LordLink



Joined: 11 Oct 2007
Posts: 79

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 7:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why does no-one like raking canopy in limited? its certainly better than viridescent wisps and would have hosed that deck round 1.

Personally I would have taken Quillspike over Flame Jab, thats twice now you've underestimated just how good that card is in my opinion. Even if all you're doing is healing opposing wither its still incredible, and works with gift of the deity.

Lastly I think Desecrator Hag over WickerBough Elder was wrong. 4 for a 4/4 destroying enchantments is good (and quillspike could have healed it if necessary).
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metzel_usa



Joined: 01 Jan 2006
Posts: 124

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 7:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Elder is absolutely rediculous....no way do you take hag over elder in ANY situation possible no matter what...turn 3 steel? dead...biting tethers? dead....that card is so rediculous its one of best commons for green
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the pick is closer than you think I was most likely wrong, hag is guarnteed card advantage whilst elder is situational no one with a brain is going to play an enchantment or artifact when its out, instead they will look to trade with elder then play there spell.

This is still good as it slows them down, and its effectivly a 3/3 until there is an artifact or enchantment to kill so your exagerating, try to keep your arguments fair and logical if you do they will carry more weight with anyone with a brain. Also i had gleefull sabotage already plus could possibly play turn to mist, i had answers already and the deck has a lot of very good targets for hag. Between sabotage, scuttlemutt and viridian wisp, I was happy i had enough answers for good aura's and with the increase in good removal eventide has brung, hag also fixed part of greens weakness to spot removal. I think thats a strong argument for hag, in fact Ive convinced myself to remain undecided.

And i do like canopy as a sidboard card but at the time i was worried about playables as pack one had been really weak and i knew wisp is always good enough to play main deck, if i felt i was defiantly going to be fine for playables i would have took the canopy.
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Alvaro21k



Joined: 28 Dec 2004
Posts: 78

PostPosted: Sat Aug 23, 2008 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wickerbrough Elder is one of the best commons in Eventide, there are so many enchantments/artifacts that really screw you up, the auras, the many arrest effects, biting t... i didnt like the draft overall, may be because I am too biased against green.
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ACM
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 03 Jan 2008
Posts: 156

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 2:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, Wickerbough was clearly the pick there.
Also, I fully agree with LordLink that Quillspike is very good and an absolute pick in green.
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Kaesh



Joined: 10 Nov 2004
Posts: 376

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trotsky1 wrote:
I think the pick is closer than you think I was most likely wrong, hag is guarnteed card advantage whilst elder is situational no one with a brain is going to play an enchantment or artifact when its out, instead they will look to trade with elder then play there spell.

You are the one asking "what went wrong" though, so we're telling you.
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ckfnpku



Joined: 18 Mar 2008
Posts: 28

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't like scuttle over valleymaker. Don't pick enablers before what they enable, not at this price.
Agree on elder over hag. And canopy over wisp.
Quillspike is a solid card that would have been a completely awful pick here. Because there are no persistant men.

On deckbuilding, I don't like the hag hedge mage at all. Can't say I'm a fan of 2 monstrify either.
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 8:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kaesh wrote:
Trotsky1 wrote:
I think the pick is closer than you think I was most likely wrong, hag is guarnteed card advantage whilst elder is situational no one with a brain is going to play an enchantment or artifact when its out, instead they will look to trade with elder then play there spell.

You are the one asking "what went wrong" though, so we're telling you.


I am but i can still defend my picks if i like them, though everyone is saying elder here i remain a big fan of hag. Im not a very big fan of green either, i can only draft it right if its a mana ramp deck which this did not really end up being, which is why i posted to see what other people would have done different.
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eroseninSama



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 11:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trotsky1 wrote:
Kaesh wrote:
Trotsky1 wrote:
I think the pick is closer than you think I was most likely wrong, hag is guarnteed card advantage whilst elder is situational no one with a brain is going to play an enchantment or artifact when its out, instead they will look to trade with elder then play there spell.

You are the one asking "what went wrong" though, so we're telling you.


I am but i can still defend my picks if i like them, though everyone is saying elder here i remain a big fan of hag. Im not a very big fan of green either, i can only draft it right if its a mana ramp deck which this did not really end up being, which is why i posted to see what other people would have done different.



True, but i believe it was you who said that gleeful sabotage is a beast so just looking at wicker-elder you should see card advantage a 4/4 for 4 and a gleeful sabotage in one creature card

i agree the valleymaker was a better choice imo especially due to the splash of R you had a finisher there

And 3rd mana ramp is super hard to due in limited unless double devoted druid, farhaven elf, or a lucky bloom tender that stays alive
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dv8r



Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 239

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm sorry to say that I think you messed this draft up badly, I disagree with over half of your relevent picks. That said, you learn a lot more by doing badly than you do by doing well, I'll try to point out some of the mistakes (this is solely my opinion and I'm not going to claim for one second that it's the only way to draft this SSE). Same format as always.

p1p1
obvious, but don't let it get in the way of your later picks, wrath of god is STILL good funnily enough, even when it kills all your guys. if you cast spout you should win even if you don't trade 10 for 1 or something

p1p2
ballynock cohort is one of the best white commons, crabapple cohort is just another fat guy for 5, take the white guy

p1p3
I really don't like drove of elves... imo the pick here is clearly runed cervix rider, unless you are keen to go base green, and even then it's still a great splash

p1p8
in your deck the clear pick is initiate, I would probably have been wr at this point in the draft though....

p1p9
not a lot to add to the other comments, you should have realised after your last draft how good canopy can be


p2p1
I personally prefer spriggin because it's an equally good lategame topdeck, whereas spawnwrithe is only really awesome on turn 3. Nothing particularly wrong with this pick though, especially as you have an initiate already (although not the two you might have had)

p2p2
As good as scuttlemutt is, valleymaker is simply one of the best cards in the set, even in base green. I don't see why you are ramp at this point, play a regular curve deck curving up to cohort (and valleymaker).

p2p3
Spriggin vs Gnarled Effigy, difficult pick to be sure. With your current picks, I'd probably go effigy as you've seen no red to suggest that you'll be able to pick up a lot of removal and green is very short on good tricks/removal. I can see spriggen as being the correct pick here though, I just wouldn't make it myself properly.

p2p4
It's a gamble not to take the removal here, but I guess after you failed to take valleymaker I can see the logic for howl over bolt.

p2p5
I don't follow your thinking here, are you planning to splash last breath? There are three perfectly good green cards in the pack (Feast, Shield, Hexhunter). In fact feast is BETTER than last breath vs the cards you describe, with your current picks (i.e. no removal spells to speak of) I would probably take it from this pack.

p2p8
I don't see why you are so set on white.... after avoiding ballynock cohort second pick, either take giant or hate the consign.

p2p9
Ok, this is INCREDIBLY lucky and suggests that noone else on the table is green which gives you a great chance at 3-0 in this draft.

p2p10
Gloomwiddow. Curve, not ramp, you don't even have a devoted druid yet.

p2p11
I wouldn't criticize scrapbasket here, but mantle is fine.


p3p1
In a pt, gp day 2 or ptq t8 the pick is Hatchet Bully over Elder, but I won't criticise you for taking money.

p3p2
Spriggan is my pick looking at what you have already, Monstrify is fine though, but you wish you had the second green initiate here....

p3p3
Quillspike is SO good, but not in your deck sadly, I could see you taking it and picking up grazing kelpie/ouphes (not completely unlikely as p2p9 has shown noone else to be green). I would take Mimic, Flame Jab is fine, go 18 lands.

p3p4
Is this really worth money?

p3p5
Wickerbough Elder is arguably the top common in the set. At worst it's a hill giant/indrikh stomphowler, the fact that there are so many strong enchantments and artifacts (multiples of which you have already passed such as gnarled effigy) should convince you more. It's true, they can just not play their bomb enchantment, but then hasn't the card done its job?

p3p6
I would take Gift, nothing wrong with Hag, but you don't really have removal, so it's going to be used sparsely and in the late game. That said, this returning spriggan is SUCH a beating.

p3p7
Remember the rule. 4 green first pick commons in Eventide. Snakeform, Ouphes, Elder, Gift.

p3p8
With your current picks, take Sentinal
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 1:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah im not denying i messed the draft up, people on the other forum which is www.modosharks.com which is really good site for anyone who loves limited by the way said much the same, I still love hag but i accept elder was the pick.
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dv8r



Joined: 15 Oct 2005
Posts: 239

PostPosted: Sun Aug 24, 2008 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

there are often many correct picks, it's a good idea to try and come to your own conclusions instead of relying on other people's analysis once you've reached a certain minimum baseline (say 1800 rating or equivalent). if nothing else it will help you improve and refine your own individual drafting style, even when you are wrong.

it was commonly accepted at the start of the season that gnarled effigy, lurebound scarecrow and barrenton medic were weak cards, but now they're taken very highly at the pro level (well, from my experience at gp madrid and brussels)

the important thing is that you were willing to argue for hag over elder rationally, there's nothing to say that hag isn't correct, even if other people argue otherwise
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standarizeMA



Joined: 09 Mar 2008
Posts: 195

PostPosted: Tue Aug 26, 2008 11:12 am    Post subject: k Reply with quote

Pack 1 ; Pick 1: Everybody first picks firespout. I would've taken Safehold Elite first. You need creatures. Firespout also isnt a one sided WoG.
Pack 1 ; Pick 2: Ballynock Cohort is the pick. It's very good. Fits the curve nicely.
Pack 1 ; Pick 3: It's pretty good actually. Should've taken Runed-Cervin Rider.
Pack 1 ; Pick 7: Pili-Pala is so good. End of story.
Pack 2 ; Pick 2: I think I would've taken Farhaven Elf. Eventide makes me tend to splash a third color for like a Recumbent Bliss or something.
Pack 2 ; Pick 9: I'm not saying your pick was wrong at all Spriggan is a very aggresive good curved Creature. But Lockjaw Snapper doesn't get as much credit as he should. He's really good in my opinion.
Pack 2 ; Pick 10: I'm surprised it tabled. The drafters you played with were horrible.
Pack 2 ; Pick 12: Niveous Wisps is better than the green wisps. By far lol
Pack 3 ; Pick 2: Spriggan is the pick. Monstrify terribles. Since it's sorcery speed it's not that good.
Pack 3 ; Pick 3: Quillspike isn't terrible And it's more productive in your deck than a non playable Flame Jab.
Pack 3 ; Pick 4: I think Harvest Gwyllion is better than a $1 rare.
Pack 3 ; Pick 5: Both solid. Personally I'd take Elder but it's a choice.
Pack 3 ; Pick 6: Very good late pick.
Pack 3 ; Pick 7: Aerie Ouphes is better than the spider.
Pack 3 ; Pick 8: Hoof skulkin. Good for your curve solid late game.
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