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Glowpole
Joined: 11 Feb 2008
Posts: 26
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 Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 4:11 pm Post subject: MWs shuffle y does it suck so? |
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| Anyone else been just gettin extremly horrible hands shuffling? I mean one shuffle i'll get 6 lands then the next no land...this has been going on all deck with every deck i use and i know for a fact that i have more than enough lands. ugh. |
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Trotsky1
Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1459
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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| Its as random as possible, unlike IRL shuffling. |
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Kytep
Joined: 21 May 2006
Posts: 163
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 4:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Trotsky1 wrote: | | Its as random as possible, unlike IRL shuffling. |
That's where I think the disconnect is: People get "spoiled" by IRL shuffling, where they layer/mana-stack/whatever to get more consistent land draws (most will say "more random", but if that's the true goal I say stop layering and just shuffle more times), which is not random but gives them those more consistent land draws. Then, when they encounter a much more random shuffler like MWS and lost that consistency, it gives them fits (as it did me, until I read some evidence of the randomness of the MWS shuffler).
Kytep |
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Hank333
Joined: 23 Oct 2006
Posts: 304
Location: San Antoni
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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| I don't have that many problems with the mws shuffler to be honest. Mana screw is a part of the game. Its all statistics. MWS Shuffler isn't that bad, maybe you just suck at deck building. |
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r3wind
Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1197
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 6:17 pm Post subject: |
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 Land stacking will get you booted from a dci tourney. Well if a judge or a player sees you. Keep in mind any kind of deck stacking or drawing from the bottom is cheeting! That is one of the reasons that in top 8 of some pt videos you see the players shuffle up for like 3 mins. |
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Thorns
Joined: 16 Aug 2006
Posts: 863
Location: Rath
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 7:05 pm Post subject: |
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Just hit ctrl + s more than once. The MWS Shuffler is a very advanced randomizing system.
I concur with Kytep. Physical shuffling only gets you so far. |
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kj_4247
Joined: 15 Apr 2007
Posts: 26
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 7:25 pm Post subject: Your deck is already shuffled |
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| I HATE HATE HATE when people spend the first 30 seconds of a game pressing crtl+S. It doesn't matter. Yur deck is pre shuffled BY A COMPUTER! you don't have to press ctrl+s and it is even more pointless to do it mulitple times. It changes nothing stop being an idiot. |
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Manipulation
Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Posts: 319
Location: Oxnard
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 7:34 pm Post subject: Re: Your deck is already shuffled |
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| kj_4247 wrote: | | I HATE HATE HATE when people spend the first 30 seconds of a game pressing crtl+S. It doesn't matter. Yur deck is pre shuffled BY A COMPUTER! you don't have to press ctrl+s and it is even more pointless to do it mulitple times. It changes nothing stop being an idiot. |
Yes, god forbid 30 seconds of your life be taken away by someone who wants to make sure its randomized...[/sarcasm]
If it cuts down on players griping on the shuffler, then who cares? |
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curly
Joined: 20 Nov 2007
Posts: 68
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 7:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I HATE HATE HATE when people spend the first 30 seconds of a game pressing crtl+S. It doesn't matter. Yur deck is pre shuffled BY A COMPUTER! you don't have to press ctrl+s and it is even more pointless to do it mulitple times. It changes nothing stop being an idiot. |
my god what the hell is so bad about shuffling for 30 seconds. i do it and it makes sure its random. and one suffle isent the most random it can be so y dont you just chill and lsitin to music or something for 30 seconds. or better yet suffle your self. |
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YTheAlien
Joined: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 72
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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| curly wrote: | | Quote: | | I HATE HATE HATE when people spend the first 30 seconds of a game pressing crtl+S. It doesn't matter. Yur deck is pre shuffled BY A COMPUTER! you don't have to press ctrl+s and it is even more pointless to do it mulitple times. It changes nothing stop being an idiot. |
my god what the hell is so bad about shuffling for 30 seconds. i do it and it makes sure its random. and one suffle isent the most random it can be so y dont you just chill and lsitin to music or something for 30 seconds. or better yet suffle your self. |
Yes it is. Every shuffle 100% randomizes your deck, including the one that occurs when you load the game, so actually using the shuffle button is completely unnecessary pregame. |
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Conkisstador
Joined: 08 Sep 2004
Posts: 378
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:47 pm Post subject: |
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1 shuffle is a matrix of hundreds of permutations... and is sufficiently random. it's way more than you could ever compute, so we'll call it infinity.
2x infinity = infinity.
shuffling twice does nothing but waste time.
people complain about bad hands because they want an excuse for losing. Read some Freudian Defense Mechanism literature and see what that's all about.
As far as: "i get screwed way more online"
that's because you play a higher volume of games online. shuffling takes .5 seconds instead of 1 minute. add it all up and make everything computer-fast and you just get to paly way more games, period.
more games = more times you get screwed
... but also = more times you get fed god-draw
Enjoy a shuffler and system that lets you paly from your comfy seat at home and lets you play twice as many games as irl. |
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Marit
Joined: 25 Dec 2006
Posts: 2
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:48 pm Post subject: |
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| You people are funny. MWS shuffler is less random than normal shuffling, because random doesn't exist to computers. The shuffler uses an algorithm that isn't perfect, and winds up clumping lands. You people saying that it's "completely random" are ridiculous, you should brush up on some basic computer facts. |
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Knightmarex
Joined: 20 Oct 2007
Posts: 9
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Thank you Marit, for being the only one correct here. It is quite obvious how unrandom the shuffler can be at times, how could anyone say that it is 100% random? |
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DaveK
Joined: 26 Nov 2007
Posts: 54
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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You, people, are stupid.
http://www.mwsgames.com/index.php/MWS_Shuffler
Recap for those who are not able to read through more than 100 words: MWS shuffler is as random as something finite is mathematically possible to get. |
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Kytep
Joined: 21 May 2006
Posts: 163
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| Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 10:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Conkisstador wrote: | people complain about bad hands because they want an excuse for losing. Read some Freudian Defense Mechanism literature and see what that's all about.
As far as: "i get screwed way more online"
that's because you play a higher volume of games online. shuffling takes .5 seconds instead of 1 minute. add it all up and make everything computer-fast and you just get to paly way more games, period.
more games = more times you get screwed
... but also = more times you get fed god-draw |
I think you nailed it, Conkisstador. People remember the "screwed" games more and blame them on the shuffler. But when the get the "God" draws, they don't credit those to the shuffler; they chalk those up to their own "skill."
For way too many on MWS,
I won = "I'm so skilled"
I lost = "I got screwed by the shuffler and/or you're a noob"
I think the thing that sucks the most about MWS is the maturity level (lack thereof) of the people who play it. (That, and the random disconnects, so it's hard sometimes to tell whether it's MWS screwing up or if it's some immature loser who can't stand yet another loss)
Kytep |
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