MUC for ptq need any help i can get

cheese79 · Joined: 24 Feb 2006 Posts: 1

first off im low on cash like really low so try not to sugest to many high money cards
i was going to run train wreck but i dont have enough money and i really want to go to this ptq so i decided to run muc so any ideas let me know

Lands
14 [9E] Island (3)
3 [MR] Stalking Stones
4 [MR] Seat of the Synod
2 [CS] Dark Depths

// Creatures
1 [CHK] Meloku the Clouded Mirror
3 [DS] Spire Golem

// Spells
4 [7E] Counterspell
4 [RAV] Remand
4 [7E] Force Spike
4 [CHK] Hinder
3 [CS] Counterbalance
3 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
4 [MR] Thirst for Knowledge
1 [IN] Fact or Fiction
3 [9E] Rewind
3 [CS] Jester's Scepter

// Sideboard
SB: 4 [SC] Stifle
SB: 2 [BOK] Quash
SB: 3 [8E] Unsummon
SB: 3 [TSB] Tormod's Crypt
SB: 3 [MR] Annul

again try not to sugest high cost cards and dont flame plz

Enyeez · Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 65

14 islands seems low when playing golems, and Vedalken Shackles..... except I dont see the shackles.

the scepter seems unneeded, and you should try and get spell burst in there., and... Teferi is nothing short of amazing when it comes to getting the opponent to play after your tune.

Russell_Nash · Joined: 05 Jan 2006 Posts: 645 Location: Burn Ward

I agree with everything Enyeez said

Also: Dark Depths is bad. REALLY bad. Its often not a issue that comes up much but: lands that don’t tap for mana are for the most part terrible. cut dark depths for 2 islands. Trust me, its an improvement.

Id also consider another meloku or two.

Fact or Fiction is totally awesome, id play more.

Teferi would be really good SB card.

Spyx · Joined: 31 Oct 2004 Posts: 852

I don't know if vedalken shackles is expensive but it's an awesome card. Also cut dark depths because it sucks.

Laria · Joined: 20 Apr 2006 Posts: 6

17 Island (3)
3 Stalking Stones
4 Seat of the Synod

// Creatures

4 Spire Golem

// Spells
4 Counterspell
4 Remand
4 Force Spike
4 Memory lapse
4 Boomerang
4 Thirst for Knowledge
2 Fact or Fiction
4 Vedalken shackless
2 Cunning wish

Side//

1 Fact or fiction
1 Echoing truth
1 Stifle
1 Evacuation
3 Gigadrowse
2 Meloku
2 Teferi, mage of Zhalfhir
4 Arcane laboratory

I think that the changes are not very expensive, and it is a better version, but is only my opinion

Enyeez · Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 65

meloku is still good, but I dont really think you need him, and I think teferi is stronger.

I suggest playing 2 teferis main, and I dont know.. remand, AND lapse, they are both GOOD!!! counters, but playing 8 couters that doesn't really get rid of the spell,. in a deck, where 99% of the time they are going to get it again (non-combo deck) - you would probably be better off with Buyback counters, or more expensive counters, like rewind, or Cancel, maybe even Hinder because it's better in ext.

Leaks, Rune Snags and Force Spikes... mmh, well... they ARE good, but you need something to discard them too later, like thirst for knowledge.

Im not a big fan of fact or fiction in MUC, but it IS good.

I think it's the combination of WISH and FOF that doesn't quite do it for me.

Wish is good, but in a fast game, doesn't really do anything, it CAN! improve hard matches, but not if they are quick ones.
fof, is also best against bad players, and in long games.

when I was playing MUC. it was all about surviving the first 6-7 turns. then you more or less have the game.

boomerangs and shackles help here, and shackles can win games by itself.

Arcane Lab is good, but not by itself.

these are just pointers, but I suggest atleast 25 lands.
4 man lands
3-4 synod, when you have shackles you can pich the 3rd, or if you get too many golems.

maybe! considder snow theme, for scrying sheets, but that's just theory.

as for the last listed decklist, I would cut either the fofs, OR the wishes, probably the fofs,
swap lapses with hinders, and take out a single spike for 1 land.

sideboard:

3 teferi
3 manashort (combo meta)
3 crypt (or stream of conciousness (sp?)) (yes stream, I used to play it main)

and another 6 meta choices

spellburst is good, especially when playing lands EVERY turn.
at some point he'll run out of threats, and if by then you're holding the burst, you win. (should really be main decked, 1 or 2), OR if you use it with Laboratory.

ONE more thing.
as the current metagame is heavy BOROS, and UW tron, you need stifle access (trickbind), and you NEEEED to be able to deal with the small little creatures, and Im not sure you can..

it's been a while since I played the deck, so Im not soooo up to date.. but these are just pointers, dont blame me if it doesn't turn out well... (but please do should you succeed)

<3

Goji · Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 102

I think u just loose to boros unless u play desert or play some black for darkblast or something

aldaryn · Joined: 02 Sep 2004 Posts: 450

Piracy charm ftw! Oh wait, that's not out yet.

I should probably say something useful.

Someone mentioned Boomerang for surviving the early game, I think Repeal is worth considering since you don't wanna bounce lands and are probably bouncing 1-2cc creatures.

Desert is not a bad idea.

Vodka_7up · Joined: 06 Oct 2004 Posts: 188

Don't forget Tormond's Crypt. Take out the scepter as well. Also try Arcane Laboratory for storm decks. Also maybe stalking stones for deserts and caltrops from the board, interesting creature control. Also Sun Droplet might help out vs Boros and the like. Also Phyrexian Ironfoot main deck would help your boros match up, just removal your basic islands for snow islands. Also if you bring in Ichorid hate I suggest doing it in 1-2 off's, that way they're harder to cabal away.

Also Enzyeez why do you consider Teferi > Meloku? Sure Teferi really messes up the opponent, but a quick unanswered Meloku can wreck quite a few decks.

Goji · Joined: 09 Apr 2006 Posts: 102

looks alot better but he said to try to not suggest too many hgih cards, which this deck does have some money ( but it is cheap for extended )

Errect · Joined: 02 Jan 2007 Posts: 12

I just scanned through everyone's replies so I don't know what was said. Would counterbalance fit into here with the tops?

Enyeez · Joined: 18 Nov 2004 Posts: 65

I think Teferi > Meloku cause he's instant, and he can lock the opponent with Spellburst (a good semi lock anyways), and he allows for combat tricks with instant golems.

I never really liked Meloku in the deck, but he is good.

after repliying yesterday, I refound my love for this deck, and tested it online, with moderate results.

the "old" muc was designed to combat the metagame, and to do that here, we need a good view on the current metagame in ext.

we know it has heavy Boros, and quite a bit of eight-post (TaN and UW).

I loaded my old MUC deck, and saw a sideboard card I used back then, against weenie, and it was good!

Engineered Explosives, (only playable for 0 and 1 - but it used to be amazing - splash a second colour, to improve your boros matchup - but no more than 4 ravnica duals)

splashing a second colour would allow you to improve your wish targets quite a bit,
1 Darkblast (if you go with Black)
1 Orims Chant (if you go with White)

Teferi, chant/scepter, or
Arcane Lab, scepter/counterspell

a few comboes to lock your opponent down completely.

I played 19 Islands, 1 Academy Ruins, 4 Stalking Stones, and 1 Seat of the Synod. (more seats, 3 I think, less Islands) Deserts would work.

the counter setup is the hardest part,

you want Rewinds if you're playing teferi, and if you're not, they are still good.

Counterspell

Mana Leak, Rune Snag,not both

Remand, Mem Lapse, not both

Hinder, Cancel, not both

Spike, maybe - they are good, but as the game goes on, they become alot worse.

Spell Burst, I just cant put these down, the lock is powerful, and it will win you games. (lock with lab or teferi)

Card Draw, in ext you have quite a few options I did not have in Standard, fact or fiction, Wish and now Whispers of the Muse (from TS)

Thirst of Knowledge, Concentrate, Fact or Fiction, Wish, Whispers of the Muse,

Thirsts are really good, but you need more, I'll let you decide, but keep it instant, and low costed (mana)

Adding Wishes would allow you to have some answers I did not have answers to, Trickbind/Stifle, and such.

Aldaryn mentioned Piracy Charm, which is not bad at all, but if your tournament is soon, it will not be legal :\

Boomerang is better than Repeal in the old t2, and in the new ext, in my oppinion, because, you can return lands to their owners hands, with the low land count of boros, and the high land requirements for the eight-post deck to work, they also have little blue and white mana available, and posts come into play tapped.
Boomerang also allows you to play shackles on turn 5, seeing them waste a card to deal with your biggest threat is just priceless.

annnnnyway, I will check up on you guys later, I have work Smile

dargor76 · Joined: 28 Jan 2007 Posts: 1

Here is the decklist I will be playing in PTQ...:

// Lands
1 [ON] Polluted Delta
1 [ON] Flooded Strand
2 [TSP] Academy Ruins
16 [CS] Snow-Covered Island
2 [CS] Scrying Sheets

// Creatures
3 [DS] Spire Golem
4 [CS] Phyrexian Ironfoot

// Spells
4 [CS] Rune Snag
4 [FD] Vedalken Shackles
4 [MR] Thirst for Knowledge
3 [CHK] Sensei's Divining Top
4 [CS] Counterbalance
4 [A] Counterspell
3 [IN] Fact or Fiction
2 [DS] Echoing Truth
3 [MR] Chrome Mox

// Sideboard
SB: 4 [SOK] Pithing Needle(solution, tog...)
SB: 4 [TSB] Tormod's Crypt(tog, CAL, Ichorid...)
SB: 4 [SC] Stifle(combo)
SB: 3 [TSP] Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir(control)

Chrome mox give a real important acceleration in early game especially vs boros or zoo where you need to drop early a shackles.
I don't play man land because blue mana is essential and you need UU quickly in the early game. The only non-blue land I play are scrying sheet, as a good drawer(more than 1/3 of the deck is snowed).
I only play 2 fetch-land because you often need 'em when you want to use top and only reveal 3 lands. They are good shufflers.
Phyrexian ironfoot is a really powerfull creature. it is a very good defenser vs aggro and cans deal a lot of damage fast. The fact that you can atatck with him and block during your opponent turn with him is also determinent.