Is Merfolk a serious deck?

Chiznitt1 · Joined: 14 Apr 2008 Posts: 8

Yea I'm going to give Reveillark a try as a 2-3 next FNM and maybe give Sygg, River Guide a try again as a 2-3 since I see so many decks packed full of removal.

I don't think countering early and then throwing creatures out with counter support is any way to combat a deck with lots of creature removal. Mostly because merfolk generally doesn't seem to run that much counter these days to do that. Lists are what 3-4 Sage's Dousing and 3-4 Cryptic Command?

It seems to me the merfolk game plan is to attack early and if that fails your opponent has probably burnt their hand to stop you and you counter their stronger late threats and win via card advantage with all your cantrips.

But I guess it all depends on how you built your merfolk deck I suppose. Lots of options.

Chiznitt1

TekNique · Joined: 19 Mar 2008 Posts: 157

I know Dan chose sage's dousing over rune snag but is it worth it without the banneret out?

Personally i think rune snag>sage's dousing but what are other people's opinions?

Vedrfolner · Joined: 04 Apr 2006 Posts: 1209

cntrolphilip · Joined: 19 May 2008 Posts: 4

practically merfolks have the advantage against faeries and reveillarks Very Happy

Chiznitt1 · Joined: 14 Apr 2008 Posts: 8

Well I'm give my thoughts on a couple of cards people seem to debate over.

Ancestral Visions vs Ponder
Sage's Dousing vs Rune Snag

Well they are all great cards that fit well into a merfolk deck. But I'd say in general Ancestral Visions and Rune Snag are better cards. But Ponder and Sage's Dousing in a merfolk deck have the potential to be better in the right draws. Sage's Dousing as you know could be 1u or u to counter a spell and draw a card and ponder can let you keep some crazy hands you normally would not.

It really depends on how you plan to run your merfolk if your running more aggressive ponder is more likely to be helpful because your opponent should be pretty much dead by the time Visions goes off. And if your running more control you have probably accepted that the games are going to last long enough for visions to help and are probably running both rune snag and sage's dousing.

There are lots of options in Merfolk and its hard to go wrong. The only card slots that seem to be set in stone are the 2 lords, silvergill adept, cryptic command, and mutavaults. The rest is seems to be left up to your personal preferences and game plan.

Chizntt1

Tms-Rock · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 28

-Dan again

heres my honest opinion guys about Rune Snag and Visions and why i choose ponder and Sages.

1st of all :

Ponder Vs. Visions : No matter what Curse catcher gains priority over turn 1 visions against faeries, and since faeries has a huge % of the field right now, its kind of essential to be prepaired. Also, Visions is a horriable draw past turn 1 going second in this deck, you have no time to stop and play visions and if u did, the chances of it going off are pretty low.

Rune Snag Vs. Sage's Dousing: Rune Snag came accross my mind probably about 50thousand times to help improve match-ups, but theres acouple of problems with this card, 1st of all it dosn't replace its self like sages dousing, 2ndly you have to play 4 or its kind of pointless to play the card, 3rdly against faeries it puts u on the deffensive where sages can possibly just be chillen in hand untill you have multiable or one banneret in hands. most the time you cantrip on turn 3 and then have 2 lands open with banneret on the field, and it counters + draws which in this deck makes a big diffrence.

The usual strat vs faeries is to dish out threats from lowest priority to highist Silvergil being the lowest and Lord of Atlantis being the highist, that way they are wasting counters on your not as useful threats like Silvergil,Rejeery and etc the "Expendables". if u ever notice playing this deck vs faeries if they have counters your threats burn there hand faster than they can dish out creatures. By the time turn 4 comes 50% of the time they have 2 cards in hand and bitterblossom on the board, already have went threw Snags/Terror that were in hand. If bitterblossom has been pending on the board getting creatures for 3 turns and there pretty much top decking -2 the cards in hand which are prob Scion/Clique, your going to beable to resolve Revilark or Lord + Mirrorweave. And thats when the game ends.

And i have been testing lark like crazy its deff amazing. And 2 extra mirrorweaves in the board for G/X match-up (aggro) is deff a keeper. My list is kind of all over the place with the new updates yall are going to flip but this is what im playing atm, went 7-0-1 at fnm been rolling people on MWS for last week with it.

Revafolks-V.01

2 Revilark
4 Banneret
4 Silvergil
4 Lord of Atlantis
4 Merrow Rejeery
4 Curse Catcher

1 Wings of Velis Veil
4 Aquatic's Will
2 Mirrorweaves
4 Sages Dousing
4 Cryptic Command

4 AdakarWastes
4 Wanderwine Hub
4 Mutavault
11 Island

SB:
2 Mirrorweave
1 Revilark
4 ForgeTender
4 Removesoul
4 Temporal Isolation

I know, No Ponder OR Visions kind of crazy, but to be honest i have yet to miss it, but i would like to fit it back in, In my honest opinion Aquatic's Will is the most amazing draw in this deck. Why Wings? Its another form of lord of atlantis + MirrorWeave except u can do it all in the same turn, if its turn 4 and u have the usual set up, Curse/Banneret/SilverGil/Rejeery and no lord of atlantis to be seen, u can Wings + Rejeery untap the land since WIngs cost 1 with banneret, then go mirrorweave. Also its another source to get Mistbind clique off the board, and its great protection vs Nameless and Incenerate, on of the faeries players at my store went for the nameless on Rejeery, in response i Wings, he is now atking in the air vs no blockers (at that situation) as a 7/1. seems fair. But like i said JUST TESTING but this is some of the newer tech im trying out.

ColonelKlink · Joined: 06 Jan 2007 Posts: 1

Thx for the new list, it works great.
I used your strategy for faeries before, and i confirm it's quite effective.
But, i don't manage to side with this deck. When i look at your side, i didn't want to enter anything. Against Aggro, i want to enter everything, and don't know what to get off. A real mind mess Rolling Eyes

What can you get off the deck when you side ?

TekNique · Joined: 19 Mar 2008 Posts: 157

How does this new list do against RDW? I know you said they will waste cheap burn spells on your first couple of creatures but what if you don't draw your creatures hence card drawing. Also what if you somehow fall behind in a race? there is no way to recover with any life gain.

One last question:
Adakar Wastes vs. Mystic Gate

I think mystic gate is much better so i run 4 of those instead of the pain land so i can stay ahead in the race. what do others think?

Chiznitt1 · Joined: 14 Apr 2008 Posts: 8

Only problem I see with Mystic Gate is the possibility of starting hands with only colorless mana. Be it multiple Mystic Gates or Mutavault plus Mystic Gates. If you feel the lose of life out ways the possible mulligans then go for the mystic gates. Otherwise stick with the Wastes to advoid the chance of manascrew.

I was wondering if you guys had any thoughts on a merfolk list for a metagame that includes no faerie, reveillark or other merfolk like mine. Where I play the last top 10 decks were 3x GB elves, 2x Kithkin, 3x RDW, 1 Merfolk which was me and i think 1 Doran. Just curious to see if you guys have any suggestions on some what merfolk should look like in that environment.

Chiznitt1

Tms-Rock · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 28

I personally don't like mystic gate, and love adakar wastes, card is always helpful where gate could screw me over, just to think of the times when i got muta+Adakar in opening and didn't muligan where i would of had to with gate kind of makes it not good.

If your meta is GB Elves and Kithkin with the RDW and Stuff, u should just play Unsummons + Temp Isos in your board, both are better choices in the aggro match-up (Imo) than sower, sower is just way to slow and makes u tap out which seems, well awful in this deck.

The new version of my deck has an amazing game vs RDW from what i'v tested, so far the worse match-up if u want to call it bad would be GB elves and its pretty favorable still. Mirrorweave is just so superior in aggro match-ups. I have to play vs Samson Hybrid stompy at my local store + GB and RDW like 90% of my match-ups and i still go 4-0-1 swiss 90% of the time. Sure its just FNM, but all the people at our shop are high ranked players all testing for regionals so the results are pretty consistant. My new Sidetech vs RDW and aggro in general i'll post later this weekend after i'm done testing it, but so far its been amazing it will blow your minds >< lol Just a hint Tribal Enchantment - Giant Wink

You thought mirrorweave was good >< this is amazing ^^

TekNique · Joined: 19 Mar 2008 Posts: 157

Favor the Mighty + Mirrorweave? Perfect Defense/Offense? Which creature gets protection in a tie?

Hmmm that is the only tribal enchantment giant so now im curious Question

whateverdude · Joined: 06 Sep 2004 Posts: 98

hmm, favor the mighty=faerie tokens cant block which is pretty nice. Also a mirrorweave on the biggest creature on the board with favor the might in play b4 the attack phase=gg

Anyway, Dan I am asking again and some other guy also asked, what cards do you actually TAKE OUT of the deck when SBing ? I find really hard to remove anything. The only easy choices are removing S.Dousing vs aggro and removing A.Wills vs decks that have islands, although the last one can screw u up cuz they may not draw an island at all and get their U mana from nonbasic lands..

Tms-Rock · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 28

Im a very weird person to ask about board situation, for me i don't stapaly board vs things, if im up a game vs faeries i never board, if im up a game vs RDW I board in only forge, if im up a game vs any G/x i don't board but since u want to know what i board when i do i'll let u know

New current board (In Testing Still)
4 ForgeTender
4 Favor of the Mighty
1 Mirrorweave
1 Reveilark
2 Temporal Isolations
3 Remove Souls

Vs Faeries Game 2 if i lost Game 1: -1 Aquatic's Will , -1 Sage's Dousing, -2 Cryptic +3 RemoveSoul, +1 Revelark

(Reason Why): If im down a game and faeries board depending on wether i saw Sower 1st game or not is how i also side. If i don't see Sower 1st game, i only take out 2 Cryptics and 1 Sages for 3 Souls, if i see sower 1st games, and he sides multiable cards (if u can pay attention) usually he will board in +1 Sower , +3 Damnation, +3 Nameless INversion or Slaughterpact, total of 7 cards, increasing his creature count by 1 and subtracting from his draw portion of the deck for sideboard cards like Visions which gives him a less chance to draw 1 of 4 sowers letting to not really concern me as much as the 2 costing threats such as Nameless/Terror/Snag, So Cryptic Won't take any effect since by the time cryptic will be available for play those cards have already been used. Kind of weird i know but just my way of thinking and it never really lets me down vs faeries.

Vs RDW, if im up the 1st game i only side in Forge Tenders and thats all, because i know hes taking out single target burn for Sulf blast, and Forge is the most effective vs Forge depending on wether he is playing RDW with 12 or 16 creatures (No Gargs) If hes playing with Fanatic/Keldon/Boggart only i side in Favor of the mighty also, if hes playing Keldon/Fanatic/Garg i deffeneitly side in Favor of the mighty if hes playing Tarmogofy (Green splash) i don't side in favor the mighty. what i sideout vs red though if -4 Aquatic's Will -1 Wings of Velis Veil +4 Forge Tender +1 Revelark, if i lost 1st game i do : -4 Cryptics, -4 Aquatic's Will + 4 Forge +4 Favor of the mighty -1 Sages + 1 Revelark.

Haha but your own sb strats might work better for u its just my own type of playing style, if i don't see creatures cept for keldon and fanatic i don't side in forge i only side in Favor because all my creatures will be protected from Sulf Blast. Ill go more in deph about it later kind of in a rush, its all over the place ill have to sit down and right out my SB strats exactly and what factors i take into account while boarding.

Tms-Rock · Joined: 02 Apr 2008 Posts: 28

Okay tho this is a double post i figured u guys would want it.

Heres my theory on SB vs faeries and why i choose to take out certaint cards:

Creature base:
(2 Revelark)
4 Banneret
4 Silvergil
4 LoA
4 Rejeery
4 CurseCatcher
-these 20 cards NEVER leave your main deck while sideboarding- The 2 Revelark come out vs Hybrid Stompy for 2 Mirrorweaves that is the only sitatuion and circumstance that it comes out.

SpellBase - 15
1 Wings of Velis Veil
4 Aquatic's Will
2 Mirrorweave
4 Sages Dousing
4 Cryptic command

:Heres the break down to take in account while boarding:
Aquatic's Will- This card never drops bellow 3 after boarding unless its vs Revelark/Control with a solid blue mana base and ever then its still iffy just because of how powerful this card is on turn 3 with rejeery.

Wings of Velis Veil- 1 of that is great in the Faeries/RDW/and G or W/x Aggro match-ups, its a suprise factor when its in your hand, and vs faeries if they atk and u have one land open, chances are if they sowered they will atk with the sower, Wings is great in this situation also, but game 2 this is the card most commonly boarded out. Vs faeries i have a hard time boarding this card out it makes the game go by so much quicker when u draw it, and its amazing when your on the recovery vs sower as i said. But vs Red and G/x aggros this card is a board out, unless u don't need to board. Commonly i vs GB elves i board 1 wings out for 1 Revelark or Mirrorweave depending on the build. (If shriekmaw is in the main or if u saw it Lark comes in Otherwise Mirroweave comes in)

Cryptic Command- In the faeries match-up this is what i most comonly sideout because by the time its going to come in effect, there hand is depleted from there early turn threats and there creatures dmg per turn dosn't compair to your creatures dmg perturn. Commonly (when i side) i do -2 Cryptics for +2 Remove soul and -1 sages for the 3rd Soul. Also other things to take in effect when boarding out cryptic is that if u win game 1 turn 4 for them u only have 3 lands, there either going to Damnation (Which Curse catcher can handle) or Sower, so cryptic has no use vs 4th turn when there on the play at any time in the game. Where Removesoul and Sages dousing both are effective.

Sages Dousing- I commonly board this out vs RDW, usually -4 for +4 Forge or Favor of the Mighty, also in the RDW match-up if its (light) on creatures, i do -1 Aquatic's Will and -1 Wings of Velis Veil + either Forge or Favor giving so far a total of 6 = either 4 favors and 2 Forge or 4 Forge and 2 Favors, if its heavy creature base obviously Forge is better, if light creature base obviously Favor is better, but no matter what u should have 6 cards boarding out, if u feel u need a 3rd lark vs the RDW match-up also board in a 3rd lark for 1 cryptic. If you totally feel threaten by the match-up go all out and do -4 Cryptic - 4 Sages -1 Aquatic's +4 Favor + 4 Forge +1 Revelark.

This atm is the best i can explain it seeing as the metagame is alittle off, your either going to run into a ton of faeries and no RDW, of a ton of RDW (in later rounds) and some faeries lol, kind of a hypacrit answere but its the metagame.

Also- If u feel like mirrormatching is going to be a problem at your current regionals or FNM, do not hesitate to -3 Remove Souls from the board and play +3 Merfolk Asn. Merfolk Asn destroys the mirror match. when boarding vs the mirror match u need to do the following -2 Revelark -4 Aquatic's Will +1 mirrorweave +3 Merfolk asn(if u have it in board) +2 Temporal Isolation. If your not playing Merfolk Asn, instead do -1 Aquatic's Will -2 sage's Dousing +3 Remove Souls, seeing as aquatic's will helps u out in drawing cryptics+Mirrorweaves.

Last Question to be answered: Why Exactly are u playing Temp Isolation- And to be honest its extremely good vs Hybrid Stompy, and its very good vs GW ramp if you find an abundance in your metagame. Temporal Isolation is another card that can be replaced for Merfolk Asns. If ur expecting no Hybrid Stomp/GW ramp -2 Temp Isos +2 Merfolk Asn, because its always nice to have an advantage on the mirrormatch. (also it allows u to not be afraid to drop lord 1st ^^)

-Why don't I side in favor of the mighty vs Mirror/Faeries- Simply to do with, if Faeries drops clique i can't do anything about clique till i drop a revelark, and in the mirror match if u drop Favor of the mighty on turn 2 and there accelling creatures on turn 3, your obviously not going to be able to keep up, now what i have been testing and would love to hear some feed back is -1 Aquatic's Will -1 Sages Dousing for +2 Favor of the mighty vs the Merfolk mirror (i'v been testing it) its good on turn 3 or 4 if u get the nuts with double banneret and drop Favor late to get creatures accross. and on turn 4 if u are on the play game 3 favor in the late can be dropped to accell your creatures threw but this sb strat is a double sided blade as it can backfire on u and allow them to get accross faster also. (considering in the mirror you usually hold Lord in hand till u know u can win)

whateverdude · Joined: 06 Sep 2004 Posts: 98

Isn't Aven Riftwatcher more effective with 3xReveilark in the deck post SB ?
Thx for the explanations!