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Suggestions for the New Site



 
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nammfoodle



Joined: 03 Mar 2010
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 6:27 pm    Post subject: Suggestions for the New Site Reply with quote

Azania is open to suggestions for the new website, so a thread to discuss it would be nice. I'm mainly a casual player (in the sense that I enjoy novelty and socializing more than winning, not in the "I suck at magic" sense), so my suggestions are mostly looking to keep magic-league from going too far towards the no-items-fox-only-guys-stop-having-fun end of the spectrum. The suggestions here are also only the ones that I don't think have been suggested before. There's a lot of stuff being fixed on the new site, so my more obvious complaints--like about the slapdash placement of links--is probably already getting fixed.

With the new site, I don't want to have to sit around and wait for a judge to host a draft if there is 8+ people in #draft4you waiting to play, so please allow non-judges to host them. They don't have to count toward players' league scores and you can have a prominent "Casual Draft" sign when players join, but I just don't want #draft4you to become a place where players are sitting around minibegging because that's the only way they can get a draft going.

If nonjudge members can host nonleague drafts, being able to put MWS spoilers into the draft software would be another improvment worth making. The biggest draw to #draft4you is when a new set comes out and people want to try out the cards before the prerelease. This is the time the channel gets the most traffic, with players new, old, competitive, or casual all coming in excited to test out the cards that were just posted on MTGSalvation. Since the cards aren't in the Gatherer yet, allowing MWS spoilers would let the excited flood of players to play with the new cards, even though Magic-League can't give league points for it (it's not official until it's in the Gatherer, right?). Being able to draft MWS spoilers would also mean casual custom card drafts would still be possible, as well as making custom cubes easier. Custom cube lists wouldn't have to be imported through MWS Spoilers though. Since the cards are all in the Gatherer, it might be easier to allow players to just give the draft site their card list (and appropriate rarities if your cube has them). If it's worth the time and effort coding, having two separate options for drafters--one for MWS spoilers one for card lists--would be ideal.

Once players have joined the draft, a chatbox of some sort would be really conveinent so people don't have to keep flipping back and forth between IRC and the mainpage to keep in contact with both the host and their picks. If adding a chat client is too much coding, you might be able to modify the java client you already have to do the job(make it a bit smaller and more simplified so it doesn't take up too much of the space reserved for the cards). You could either have it create a new chatroom or connect back to #draft4you, just as long as players can draft and talk to each other at the same time.

After the draft starts, I've always thought a 'spectate' option would be really cool. It'd be great for new players who could watch a draft or two before deciding to jump in, and also for channel regulars who didn't make it in before it filled or don't want to make a time commitment but still feel like participating in the conversation. They have spectating in online chess rooms, and sometimes in poker rooms as well, and I'd really like to see it here as well. Hosts obviously would need to have the option to not allow spectators for their draft, or to allow spectators to join but not talk, or to kick/ban/silence individual spectators, so if a host is worried about cheating or just doesn't want to have to handle the added stress of dealing with more people in his draft he can just turn the option off.

And finally I'd like to throw this list of draft variants onto the pile in case any of them spark your fancy and are worth coding:

Singletons draft (a given card only appears once per draft.)
commons-only or commons/uncommons-only draft
Winston draft (http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtgcom/daily/af59)
Winchester draft (http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/ld/143)
Rooster draft (aka super-sealed, players open all packs, look over the contents, then take turns picking entire packs instead of individual cards)
bubble constructed (probably casual only, players open their sealed pool and are then allowed to trade with other players in between matches)

This forum is dead, but that's okay. Now I can link people here whenever the topic of the new site gets brought up in the channel and people will have a place to compile other suggestions.
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Ciberon



Joined: 14 Jun 2010
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Winchester is an awesome way to draft, however, it's not worth implementing, as it wouldn't be used tournament-wise.
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niknight



Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 261

PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 7:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Suggestions for the New Site Reply with quote

nammfoodle wrote:

With the new site, I don't want to have to sit around and wait for a judge to host a draft if there is 8+ people in #draft4you waiting to play, so please allow non-judges to host them. They don't have to count toward players' league scores and you can have a prominent "Casual Draft" sign when players join, but I just don't want #draft4you to become a place where players are sitting around minibegging because that's the only way they can get a draft going.


This is already allowable now. You don't need a judge to host a draft. If you can get 8 people together, you can just decide pairings through a bunch of league games. The only two advantages to having a judge are making the draft 16K, and getting the ratings points if your opponent doesn't accept the challenge. Casual (nonrated) drafts are acceptable as well.


nammfoodle wrote:

If nonjudge members can host nonleague drafts, being able to put MWS spoilers into the draft software would be another improvment worth making. The biggest draw to #draft4you is when a new set comes out and people want to try out the cards before the prerelease. This is the time the channel gets the most traffic, with players new, old, competitive, or casual all coming in excited to test out the cards that were just posted on MTGSalvation. Since the cards aren't in the Gatherer yet, allowing MWS spoilers would let the excited flood of players to play with the new cards, even though Magic-League can't give league points for it (it's not official until it's in the Gatherer, right?). Being able to draft MWS spoilers would also mean casual custom card drafts would still be possible, as well as making custom cubes easier. Custom cube lists wouldn't have to be imported through MWS Spoilers though. Since the cards are all in the Gatherer, it might be easier to allow players to just give the draft site their card list (and appropriate rarities if your cube has them). If it's worth the time and effort coding, having two separate options for drafters--one for MWS spoilers one for card lists--would be ideal.


I don't think you have even the slightest clue as to how onsite draft works.

nammfoodle wrote:

Once players have joined the draft, a chatbox of some sort would be really conveinent so people don't have to keep flipping back and forth between IRC and the mainpage to keep in contact with both the host and their picks. If adding a chat client is too much coding, you might be able to modify the java client you already have to do the job(make it a bit smaller and more simplified so it doesn't take up too much of the space reserved for the cards). You could either have it create a new chatroom or connect back to #draft4you, just as long as players can draft and talk to each other at the same time.


I didn't realize that dividing the screen between two windows was that much work...

nammfoodle wrote:

After the draft starts, I've always thought a 'spectate' option would be really cool. It'd be great for new players who could watch a draft or two before deciding to jump in, and also for channel regulars who didn't make it in before it filled or don't want to make a time commitment but still feel like participating in the conversation. They have spectating in online chess rooms, and sometimes in poker rooms as well, and I'd really like to see it here as well. Hosts obviously would need to have the option to not allow spectators for their draft, or to allow spectators to join but not talk, or to kick/ban/silence individual spectators, so if a host is worried about cheating or just doesn't want to have to handle the added stress of dealing with more people in his draft he can just turn the option off.


Coding something like this would be an incredible pain in the neck, even if we had a team of people working on it. Suffice it to say, this will not happen.
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kendiggy



Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 441
Location: not here

PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about adding a "Like" option in the forums Razz That must be impossible, considering how facebook still hasn't added a dislike option despite all the outcry for it Smile
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nammfoodle



Joined: 03 Mar 2010
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 7:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

niknight wrote:
nammfoodle wrote:

blah blah blah casual drafts blah blah blah minibegging blah blah

This is already allowable now. You don't need a judge to host a draft.

I should make it clearer for those that haven't heard much about the new site that I'm worried that things won't stay that way. The way Azania was describing it it sounded like drafts would be put in a similar place as Sealed where if you wanted to play you'd have to either go find a site/program yourself (don't underestimate the difficulty of getting seven other people to agree on a time/place/format/software to use using only IRC) or wait for a judge to host an official competitive tournament. I like the current system of drafting where there's an "official" way to draft casually and I don't want the new site to disrupt that.

niknight wrote:

nammfoodle wrote:

chatbox.

I didn't realize that dividing the screen between two windows was that much work...

Glad I mentioned that then. I almost didn't because it seemed like such a basic part of multiplayer gaming, but you never know what's going to be left out because the creator didn't hear anyone say they wanted it.

kendiggy wrote:
How about adding a "Like" option in the forums Razz That must be impossible, considering how facebook still hasn't added a dislike option despite all the outcry for it Smile

You currently have the option to put a poll on your thread, so you could probably get the same effect without the coding work by adding a "Do you like my idea? Y/N" poll to threads you start. If you want to 'like' individual posts, it would probably mean restructuring the discussion board to look more like Reddit, where posts are sorted by the number of thumbs-ups they have. In fact, if people like the idea enough it'd probably be more convenient just to start a new forum using Reddit's existing structure than to code one by scratch.

Ciberon wrote:
it's not worth implementing, as it wouldn't be used tournament-wise.

That's a discussion for another thread, but I disagree entirely with that attitude. Glad I'm not the only fan of Winchester though.
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 8:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Okay, some big suggestions here:


1.) The ability to do sealed deck in singles matches.

This is most likely the biggest one. I don't wanna have to depend on a judge to start a mini so I can get my sealed practice in. I imagine this wouldn't be that difficult to do, although, it could lead to an increase in bandwidth use (maybe).


2.) Magic Workstation server-side functionality for recording a live match.

This may seem like a big thing, but if you think about, the relevant information here is already passing through the server. It seems like it wouldn't be terribly difficult to write a program that could record this and save it as a video, which would in turn allow the community easier access to improving their game. Possible problems with this would be the lack of open-source of MWS. Seriously, someone contact MWS's creators and get the source-code...use a bucket, a rat, and a blowtorch if you have to.


3.) Taking the genetics of Burton911 and Azania to make a super-coder that we keep chained up in Koen's basement and force to code the site for Cheetos, Tab, and Mountain Dew.
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niknight



Joined: 14 Oct 2004
Posts: 261

PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nammfoodle wrote:
niknight wrote:
nammfoodle wrote:

chatbox.

I didn't realize that dividing the screen between two windows was that much work...

Glad I mentioned that then. I almost didn't because it seemed like such a basic part of multiplayer gaming, but you never know what's going to be left out because the creator didn't hear anyone say they wanted it.


Nam, I wasn't being serious with that comment. It was intended as sarcasm. Dividing your screen so that one half has the draft program, and the other half has mirc is ridiculously easy... hell, they even made it a selling point of Windows 7.
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Lynolf



Joined: 25 Aug 2007
Posts: 546

PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2011 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How is it done again...? Mr. Green
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nammfoodle



Joined: 03 Mar 2010
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2011 12:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

niknight wrote:
Nam, I wasn't being serious with that comment. It was intended as sarcasm. Dividing your screen so that one half has the draft program, and the other half has mirc is ridiculously easy... hell, they even made it a selling point of Windows 7.

Well, ideally you'd have an isolated chat box for each draft like netdraft has, not just a link back to #draft4you so you don't have to herd all the drafters into a random temporary channel every time you want to draft. I just brought up #draft4you because I saw that we have a working chat box on the site already and was trying to think of a way to make use of it instead of starting from scratch.
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nammfoodle



Joined: 03 Mar 2010
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One more thing, this one's regarding the layout. Make all the stuff that new players need big, shiny, and obvious. Us regulars that are more familiar with the site (and probably more intelligent) don't need as much guidance, so sections like Articles and Coverage, Decks, and Player Login should, while still being on the main page, be less front-and-center.

Also, I know that we can't say to use MWS on the main site, but if there's anything you can do to stem the tide of new players asking "how do I play? can someone help me install?" in #magic-league, it would be greatly appreciated.
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