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mysticism



Joined: 25 Mar 2011
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your correct but its only half the answer

Cards will only be revealed if they go to a public zone (i.e battlefield, stack or graveyard). Library of Leng will indeed replace chandras effect and makes you put the card ontop of the library. But since the card is moved from one hidden zone (hand) to another hidden zone (library) it will not be revealed.

So this new addition to the rule will apply

Quote:
701.7c If a card is discarded, but an effect causes it to be put into a hidden zone instead of into its owner’s graveyard without being revealed, all values of that card’s characteristics are considered to be undefined. If a card is discarded this way to pay a cost that specifies a characteristic about the discarded card, that cost payment is illegal; the game returns to the moment before the cost was paid (see rule 714, “Handling Illegal Actions”).


So the card put ontop of the library will be of an undefined color, wich is not the same as a red card, therefore chandras ability will not deal any damage.
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

But discarding a card isn't part of the cost, it's part of the effect.

Edit: Nevermind, you were just referencing the top part of that.
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magicman85



Joined: 22 Aug 2009
Posts: 555

PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Player 1 attacks with a Glissa, the Traitor, Player 2 blocks the Glissa, the Traitor with 3 Skinrenders. Player 1 says to deal one damage to each of the Skinrenders from Glissa, the Traitor. Player 2 says no, you can only choose the order of creatures you deal damage to not where each damage goes. Who is correct?

Glissa, the Traitor
Legendary Creature - Zombie Elf

First strike, deathtouch
Whenever a creature an opponent controls is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, you may return target artifact card from your graveyard to your hand.
3/3

Skinrender
Creature - Zombie

When Skinrender enters the battlefield, put three -1/-1 counters on target creature.
3/3


Last edited by magicman85 on Sun Jun 12, 2011 1:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
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AppleofEris



Joined: 20 Dec 2006
Posts: 553

PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2011 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

First off, go read this thread for lols: http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=6414100

Quote:
510.1c A blocked creature assigns its combat damage to the creatures blocking it. If no creatures are currently blocking it (if, for example, they were destroyed or removed from combat), it assigns no combat damage. If exactly one creature is blocking it, it assigns all its combat damage to that creature. If two or more creatures are blocking it, it assigns its combat damage to those creatures according to the damage assignment order announced for it. This may allow the blocked creature to divide its combat damage. However, it can't assign combat damage to a creature that's blocking it unless each creature that precedes that blocking creature in its order is assigned lethal damage. When checking for assigned lethal damage, take into account damage already marked on the creature and damage from other creatures that's being assigned during the same combat damage step, but not any abilities or effects that might change the amount of damage that's actually dealt. An amount of damage that's greater than a creature's lethal damage may be assigned to it.
Example: The damage assignment order of an attacking Craw Wurm (a 6/4 creature) is Wall of Wood (a 0/3 creature) then Eager Cadet (a 1/1 creature). Craw Wurm can assign 3 damage to the Wall and 3 damage to the Cadet, 4 damage to the Wall and 2 damage to the Cadet, 5 damage to the Wall and 1 damage to the Cadet, or 6 damage to the Wall.


Quote:
702.2b Any nonzero amount of combat damage assigned to a creature by a source with deathtouch is considered to be lethal damage, regardless of that creature’s toughness. See rules 510.1c–d.


It looks like Wizards saw this dissidence in the rules and tweaked everything to all work the same way. Basically, Glissa still has to choose the order in which she deals her lethal damage, but for her, 1 damage IS lethal damage.
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mysticism



Joined: 25 Mar 2011
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 1:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scale controls a Griffin Sentinel and a Jackal Familiar.
I target Jackal Familiar with the ability from my Alluring Siren wich resolves at the beginning of scales combat step.

How will the declare attacker step play out?

Griffin Sentinel
2W
Flying
Vigilance
1 / 3

Jackal Familiar
R
Jackal Familiar can't attack or block alone.
2 / 2

Alluring Siren
1Blue
Tap: Target creature an opponent controls attacks you this turn if able.
1 / 1
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Abydos1



Joined: 30 May 2011
Posts: 2

PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mysticism wrote:
Scale controls a Griffin Sentinel and a Jackal Familiar.
I target Jackal Familiar with the ability from my Alluring Siren wich resolves at the beginning of scales combat step.

How will the declare attacker step play out?

Griffin Sentinel
2W
Flying
Vigilance
1 / 3

Jackal Familiar
R
Jackal Familiar can't attack or block alone.
2 / 2

Alluring Siren
1Blue
Tap: Target creature an opponent controls attacks you this turn if able.
1 / 1


Both the Griffin and Jackal have to attack.

Quote:
508.1d The active player checks each creature he or she controls to see whether it’s affected by any
requirements (effects that say a creature must attack, or that it must attack if some condition is
met). If the number of requirements that are being obeyed is fewer than the maximum possible
number of requirements that could be obeyed without disobeying any restrictions, the
declaration of attackers is illegal. If a creature can’t attack unless a player pays a cost, that
player is not required to pay that cost, even if attacking with that creature would increase the
number of requirements being obeyed.
Example: A player controls two creatures: one that “attacks if able” and one with no
abilities. An effect states “No more than one creature can attack each turn.” The only
legal attack is for just the creature that “attacks if able” to attack. It’s illegal to attack
with the other creature, attack with both, or attack with neither.


There are 4 possibilities:
Neither attack (1 requirement disobeyed, jackal must attack if able)
Jackal attacks (1 requirement disobeyed, jackal can't attack alone)
Griffin attacks (1 requirement disobeyed, jackal must attack if able)
Both attack (0 requirements disobeyed)

The active player must obey the maximum possible number of requirements thus both must attack.
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Clariax
Level 3 Judge


Joined: 16 Jan 2006
Posts: 174

PostPosted: Mon Jun 13, 2011 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Abydos1 wrote:

Both the Griffin and Jackal have to attack.

There are 4 possibilities:
Neither attack (1 requirement disobeyed, jackal must attack if able)
Jackal attacks (1 requirement disobeyed, jackal can't attack alone)
Griffin attacks (1 requirement disobeyed, jackal must attack if able)
Both attack (0 requirements disobeyed)

The active player must obey the maximum possible number of requirements thus both must attack.



The result is correct, the explanation is a little bit off. When it comes to legal sets of attackers and blockers, there's requirements and restrictions. The Siren's ability creates a requirement, the Jackal's ability a restriction. Requirements must be followed if able, restrictions cannot be violated. For the set of attackers to be legal, you must follow the maximum number of requirements without violating any restrictions.
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mysticism



Joined: 25 Mar 2011
Posts: 22

PostPosted: Wed Aug 24, 2011 12:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So Ill try a new example

I control a sword of feast and famine and activate its equip ability. My opponent wants to try and steal it and activates his spellskites ability tageting the equip.

What will happen?

Sword of Feast and Famine
Artifact — Equipment
Equipped creature gets +2/+2 and has protection from black and from green.
Whenever equipped creature deals combat damage to a player, that player discards a card and you untap all lands you control.
Equip 2

Spellskite
Artifact Creature — Horror
Phyrexian Blue: Change a target of target spell or ability to Spellskite. (Phyrexian Blue can be paid with either Blue or 2 life.)
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Farseer
Level 3 Judge


Joined: 03 Oct 2004
Posts: 335

PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As we probably all know by now:

Spellskite can target the activated ability of Swords of the Stack. When Spellskite's ability resolves it will attempt to change the target to an illegal target (equip requires "target creature you control") so will do nothing. Then the equip ability will resolve and equip to the creature it was targetting initially.

---

From #training4you -- Farseer's Unofficial Rules / Judge Training Channel

Q031: AP controls Skill Borrower and the top card of his library is Mistmeadow Witch. During his upkeep, AP activates the ability of Skill Borrower to exile Patron of the Orochi. AP then draws his card for the turn, revealing Sisters of Stone Death on top of his library. Can AP activate the third ability to return Patron of the Orochi to the battlefield under his control?
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