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Reply to topic    Magic-League.com Forum Index -> Standard (T2) Decks
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YvesHenri



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 9:24 am    Post subject: Explosion Reply with quote

...

Last edited by YvesHenri on Mon Nov 08, 2010 9:33 pm; edited 2 times in total
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magicman85



Joined: 22 Aug 2009
Posts: 555

PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 3:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the green slows your deck down too much. I think Birds of Paradise isn't that great for an aggro type deck, same with Explore. Also, the Koth in a 2 color deck where you aren't really using that many mountains can probably be taken out. Finally, why would you use a Pyroclasm in your sideboard for that deck. It will kill over half the creatures you have in that deck, Pyroclasm is better for slow decks that need a 2 drop.

Ultimately, I would say if you want to play an aggro style deck just go mono-red.
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YvesHenri



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Youre wrong, birds and explore helps A LOT.
They used in the combo and they are also good with the devastating summons, that is a second option. Koth of the hammer is also a second option, and every game I have it in game, I have at least 2 mountains, wich is pretty enough, considering the koth dies within 1-3 turns, and if not, its very annoying against a control deck. Pyroclasm is a third option and it will not "kill" my creatures, only birds and the goblin, not that big deal... I tried mono red but it sucks...

Please post your opinion!
Thanks
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moscowdemon
Level 4 Judge


Joined: 18 Dec 2008
Posts: 297

PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 4:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Explosion Reply with quote

Quote:
Im working on it... please give me your suggestions.


ok then, why ask for suggestions if ur just going to shoot down what people suggest? like im not trolling or being mean, im just wondering why u shot down his suggestion when ur asking for them.

also, i agree with him, pyroclasm seems bad here. and u might want to try lotus cobra over birds, just saying. cuz ur turn 3 win is probably near impossible. it requires 9 cards as u said... if u went first, that is ur whole hand plus ur draws, and if ur on the play it gives u 1 card to not be right, then it also gives ur opp blockers possibly. it seems nice and all, but why not just cut birds for cobra, and maybe even tuskcaller for another vengevine and then also remove the koths and ull have 3 spots for more guys so ur masticore gets better? im suggesting this, so dont jump down my throat please.
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Nixus



Joined: 08 Jan 2008
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The deck seems all over the place. Under your listed third turn kill, you stated you need two fetch lands, yet, you only run six. I think that would definitely need to be eight for the landfall triggers to even work well with the zektar and geopedes.

Also, there's way too many come into play tap lands for this deck to be fast. The third turn kill scenario seems highly unlikely. If anything, you should either change deck to suit that or stray away from it.

The tuskcaller is terrible, it doesn't synergize with anything. You have nothing to follow up the goblin guides and zektars with. A tuskcaller after a goblin guide and zektar is negligible.

I agree with the above comments on Koth. Koth suits mono red, and you only run five mountains. So there's absolutely no point for his first or second ability.

Devastating summons is for speed, not an endgame play. No bushwhacker means it should be taken out.

Why flame slash and burst lightning? Lightning bolt is still in the format.
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YvesHenri



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 10:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Explosion Reply with quote

moscowdemon wrote:
ok then, why ask for suggestions if ur just going to shoot down what people suggest? like im not trolling or being mean, im just wondering why u shot down his suggestion when ur asking for them.


Thats why its called a THREAD. People say what they want here, and it will be discussed, thats the reason I made a new thread.
Im not "trolling". Lets just forget it.

-

Ive made small changes on it, took koth, tuskcaller, and the "shock". I add'ed 3 globins, that helps with haste for the devastating summons and another small change in the lands.
Birds are better than lotus cobra, way better... (in this deck)
This deck basically can cast all the cards in hand with 3-4 turns, so would I use the lotus cobra?

also, i agree with him, pyroclasm seems bad here. and u might want to try lotus cobra over birds, just saying. cuz ur turn 3 win is probably near impossible. it requires 9 cards as u said... if u went first, that is ur whole hand plus ur draws, and if ur on the play it gives u 1 card to not be right, then it also gives ur opp blockers possibly. it seems nice and all, but why not just cut birds for cobra, and maybe even tuskcaller for another vengevine and then also remove the koths and ull have 3 spots for more guys so ur masticore gets better? im suggesting this, so dont jump down my throat please.
And yea, its hard to win in the turn 3 but its possible, the only and one deck that can do it nowadays, that I know of... And once again, even if you didnt get the combo, it can do a high damage and win at turn 4-5 max, unless....

I won moslty the control decks such as UB and UW for 2-1 and 2-0... Its just against the decks that gain life that is annoying...
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badgerigar



Joined: 20 Jan 2010
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
And yea, its hard to win in the turn 3 but its possible, the only and one deck that can do it nowadays, that I know of


Both white weenie and goblins can win on turn 2.

White weenie:
Turn 1 plains, kor duelist
turn 2: plains Quest for the holy relic, quest for the holy relic, memnite, memnite, memnite, ornithopter, ornithopter, sac quest for the holy relics for 2 argentum armour equipping to kor duelist. Swing for 26.
Uses 8 cards

Goblins:
turn 1: mountain, memnite, memnite, mox opal, tap opal for red, kuldotha rebirth sacrificing opal, mox opal, kicked goblin bushwhacker, swing for 12.
turn 2: kicked goblin bushwhacker, swing for 14
Uses 8 cards.
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Nixus



Joined: 08 Jan 2008
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 12:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
White weenie:
Turn 1 plains, kor duelist
turn 2: plains Quest for the holy relic, quest for the holy relic, memnite, memnite, memnite, ornithopter, ornithopter, sac quest for the holy relics for 2 argentum armour equipping to kor duelist. Swing for 26.
Uses 8 cards .


This is ten cards and probably turn 3.
Confused

But point proven, deck could be faster and more consistent. I think he was aiming for speed, but looking for something that retains a mid and end game.... Confused
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badgerigar



Joined: 20 Jan 2010
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Only 8 cards come from your hand. the argentum armours just need to be in your library.
Also, white weenie has a stronger late game than you might think. When you have 6 mana available every ornithopter or other tiny creature you draw gets +6/+6 and destroys a permanent when you attack. Sure, it wont compete with UB control in the late game but it has fewer dead topdecks than the list posted.
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Nixus



Joined: 08 Jan 2008
Posts: 12

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry to beat the dead horse, but it's 10. Recount the cards, second turn scenario the way you listed it not possible. You can't have 10 cards in hand, even if you play on the draw and it's your turn 2. (Not counting argentum)

I wasn't saying that Relic is a bad deck late game, I agree with you on that. Very Happy
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badgerigar



Joined: 20 Jan 2010
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 4:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hmm. it appears I can't count. My apologies
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YvesHenri



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 5:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As Nixus said, its 10 cards, besides, youre using 3 memnite, 2 ornithopter and 2 quest for the holy relic, its like 1% of chance of having it in your opening hand. The same for the goblins.
And again, as Nixus said, Im aiming for speed and for something that retains a mid and end game.
I played against white weenie, result: win. Didnt play against the goblins yet... Im getting good results with this deck, test it out.
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kumagmd



Joined: 15 Feb 2009
Posts: 307

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

here's an idea - kiln fiend, assault strobe, pump spells (if you retain your green) and FLING!

scenario:
turn 1 verge, birds
turn 2 zektar shrine expedition, fetch land, sac, mountain, goblin guide - attack for 2 (opponent, 18 life)
turn 3, play any land, sac zektar, any random pump spell (preferably groundswell) the token, assault strobe the token, attack with the 11/5 doublestrike trample token and the goblin guide, do a little dance (opponent -6 life) - cast fling

OR!
turn 1 verge, birds
turn 2 play any land, kiln fiend, attack with the birds (do a little dance)
turn 3 play any land, groundswell the fiend (7/5), assault strobe the fiend (9/5 double striker), attack! then cast fling

either way, dude, the scenarios are very, VERY iffy. so you should look for things that would do really, REALLY well on its own even if you don't have your combo out. the reason why the people here are advising against green is because going mono-red makes you more "focused". And, more likely, because your main combo does not require green. In fact, your deck does not need vengevine! it's 4cc, and for that sorta mana, mono red would already be winning (or losing, depending on how you see it =)

Again, the WW quest uses 10 cards for its turn 2 kill, please count lands =P.

Personally, I like the concept of RG beats - reminds me of the old Fires deck. If you're gonna add in green for acceleration, you have to justify it - green should make your deck GO. So, if you put in green for the first turn acceleration, your deck had better have awesome 3cc for the 2nd turn... and right now, I'm coming up with a blank on awesome red or green 3cc spells. However, remove the green accelerants, stay on mono red - with Geopede and Kiln Fiend as your mainstay 2nd turn drops, you might just have consistent third turn wins.
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YvesHenri



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Engrishskill
Yes I am playing against "randoms" on mws, and the "championship" that I meant was magic-league's. Im not "playing" magic anymore, sold all my cards and the reason I came here is that Its been 5 years since I stopped playing, and at tuesday, I decided to download mws again and play. So I realized that there was a lot of ramp decks running and I decided to make a turbo stomp deck, and with everyones help, make it better.
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YvesHenri



Joined: 21 Jan 2008
Posts: 19

PostPosted: Fri Nov 05, 2010 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Engrishskill wrote:
If you want to keep the idea of a fast RG deck going, then you need to find stronger individual cards to replace things like birds and explore. I also don't really see bushwacker/summons as being so hot. Just look into what face-smashing green creatures there are in the format(preferably under four mana imo) and see what kinds of possibilities there are.

Acceleration via: birds and explore is definitely not a good enough reason to warrant a green splash into sligh though imo.


Yea, I took a look at them, nothing interesting...
The explore stands for the acceleration, and damage increase to the geopede and shrine. About the bushwackers, I still didnt get them to work as I expect to, but yea, it seems difficult to happen...
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