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BW Lifegain Deck Help


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heyPharaoh



Joined: 01 Nov 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 6:27 pm    Post subject: BW Lifegain Deck Help Reply with quote

So I've been working on a BW Lifegain deck, I just dont know what I should do to make it faster or if I should push into Blue for more card draw/control. Any suggestions?

Lands

6 Swamp
6 Plains
4 Marsh Flats
4 Terramorphic Expanse

Spells

1cc
4 Path to Exile
4 Sunspring Expedition

2cc
4 Angelsong
4 Howling Mine
4 Rest for the Weary

3cc
4 Oblivion Ring
4 Tainted Sigil

4cc
4 Day of Judgment
2 Font of Mythos

5cc
4 Sanguine Bond

7cc
4 Absorb Vis

SB

1cc
4 Deathmark
4 Pithing Needle

3cc
2 Oblivion Ring
4 Solemn Offering

4cc
1 Font of Mythos
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InWaking



Joined: 30 Jun 2009
Posts: 137

PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 7:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Felidar Sovereign would prolly make an awesome alt win condition in the deck. Although it appears you're trying to stay away from critters. I don't like the idea of decks running Mine or Font unless they are a mill strategy you should reconsider that. Identity Crisis would also be a pretty decent card to look into.

I have also realized that you play 2 Oring main and 4 in side.

Play Everflowing chalice, Sovereign, Baneslayer (if it's meant to be MWS), possibley mindshatter, Duress, and or Mind rot. A life deck such as this needs to "Combo" so you need stuff to assist in keeping you going. This deck seems to already have a good matchup vs aggro decks so control and other random disruption is what you should worry about.

I hope this helped a bit.
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P_P4E



Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 579

PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

you have 20 lands. you need 4-5 more first of all.

Last edited by P_P4E on Tue Mar 02, 2010 8:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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heyPharaoh



Joined: 01 Nov 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2010 9:15 pm    Post subject: Re: BW Lifegain Deck Help Reply with quote

Yeah, I just dont know how to speed up my draw without Howling and Font, and it allows me to draw into the answers I need versus Aggro and get my combo quicker, thats why I dont know whether I should splash into blue for draw.

Maybe I should throw in a Felidar Sovereign, but I feel like the field has too many answers for creatures before it could roll around to my upkeep again. Maybe sideboard it for the game 2 when they take out removal?

And haha, okay, I added more lands, maybe instead of 2 Plains 2 Swamps I should throw in some Tetonic Edges.

Does this look any better? What should I take out or change around?

Lands 24

8 Swamp
8 Plains
4 Marsh Flats
4 Terramorphic Expanse

Spells 38

1cc
4 Path to Exile
2 Sunspring Expedition
4 Duress

2cc
4 Angelsong
4 Howling Mine
4 Rest for the Weary

3cc
2 Oblivion Ring
4 Tainted Sigil

4cc
4 Day of Judgment

5cc
4 Sanguine Bond

SB

1cc
4 Deathmark
4 Pithing Needle

3cc
2 Oblivion Ring
3 Solemn Offering

6cc
2 Felidar Sovereign
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asamodious



Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Posts: 362

PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 6:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

xSNACKSx wrote:
Have you though about tidehollow sculler?


sculler is absolutely horrible as your only creature.
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heyPharaoh



Joined: 01 Nov 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2010 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

xSNACKSx wrote:
I would go 7 plains 6 swamps 3 tectonic edge. Your deck is mostly white and you don't really even need to open with a swamp. But going turn 1 sunspring expedition is obviously solid for this deck. Have you though about tidehollow sculler? It gives you disruption and can act as early damage against slow hands. Also you don't need to splash blue for card draw, just add sign in blood.

What is your sideboard anyways? Wall of reverance, duress and stuff?


I agree, turn one sun spring, turn two sun spring marsh flats duress is a great opener for this deck, and gives me a huge life buffer against aggro decks, but i dont think tidehollow would really fit in, he is just immediately going to get hit with removal, or get blasted away with my own DoJ, I would just rather have no creatures than tidehollows. And the sideboard is as I posted it 4 Deathmark 4 Pithing Needle 2 Oblivion Ring 3 Solemn Offering 2 Felidar Sovereign
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Alphakiller



Joined: 26 Oct 2008
Posts: 166

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

have you thought of ajani goldmane? he's a life gain, a damage absorber, and a finisher if they can't answer. pretty good deal, i'd say.

you could also supplement a controlling aspect with silence, cast on their upkeep so that they can't do much to try and barrel into you.

have you thought of kabira crossroads? a free lifegain attacked into a EtBt land isn't that bad a deal in your deck.


marble chalice is a solid choice... but only if games are going to last a while. i'd say not actually add that one.

since you're going to be making the game last a while, obelisk of alara is a solid choice for what your deck's going to be doing. it can kill decent dudes, and it can gain you 5 life a turn. I might consider 1 or 2 of those.

and finally tainted sigil might be a funny addon to the combo. if sanguine bond is in play, it effectively doubles your life gain and their life loss for each spell that turn. being too situational, though, i'd say leave it.

so basically... to supplement the life-gain aspects in a permanent way, you may want to consider ajani goldmane and obelisk of alara.
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Vedrfolner



Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 2325

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 1:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alphakiller wrote:
have you thought of ajani goldmane? he's a life gain, a damage absorber, and a finisher if they can't answer. pretty good deal, i'd say.

you could also supplement a controlling aspect with silence, cast on their upkeep so that they can't do much to try and barrel into you.

have you thought of kabira crossroads? a free lifegain attacked into a EtBt land isn't that bad a deal in your deck.


marble chalice is a solid choice... but only if games are going to last a while. i'd say not actually add that one.

since you're going to be making the game last a while, obelisk of alara is a solid choice for what your deck's going to be doing. it can kill decent dudes, and it can gain you 5 life a turn. I might consider 1 or 2 of those.

and finally tainted sigil might be a funny addon to the combo. if sanguine bond is in play, it effectively doubles your life gain and their life loss for each spell that turn. being too situational, though, i'd say leave it.

so basically... to supplement the life-gain aspects in a permanent way, you may want to consider ajani goldmane and obelisk of alara.


It is only Goldmane's -1 ability that is useful and this is in a creatureless deck.

Kabira Crossroads should be there yes.

One Obelisk of Alara could be good yes, even only the white and black abilities. But it is really only amazing when you have red as well.

He already has Tainted Sigil.

While Sanguine Bond decks aren't competitive, they are so different to most other decks that they are funny to play I guess.

I don't think the 4 Angelsongs are good or many enough to warrant playing Howling Mine. This is not turbofog. I don't know why you run Duress - it is not like it slows them down or disrupts anything unless they have Negates for your Bond. Expedition should be a 4-of, since it is only amazing when played turn 1.

You are better off using those slots to accelerate into a Sanguine Bond as quickly as possible, so that it is in play before you have to use the lifegain cards. As it is now you have to use them to stay alive before playing Bond. Everflowing Chalice would be great for that purpose.
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Nevian



Joined: 06 Dec 2004
Posts: 178

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
It is only Goldmane's -1 ability that is useful and this is in a creatureless deck.

Kabira Crossroads should be there yes.

One Obelisk of Alara could be good yes, even only the white and black abilities. But it is really only amazing when you have red as well.

He already has Tainted Sigil.

While Sanguine Bond decks aren't competitive, they are so different to most other decks that they are funny to play I guess.

I don't think the 4 Angelsongs are good or many enough to warrant playing Howling Mine. This is not turbofog. I don't know why you run Duress - it is not like it slows them down or disrupts anything unless they have Negates for your Bond. Expedition should be a 4-of, since it is only amazing when played turn 1.

You are better off using those slots to accelerate into a Sanguine Bond as quickly as possible, so that it is in play before you have to use the lifegain cards. As it is now you have to use them to stay alive before playing Bond. Everflowing Chalice would be great for that purpose.


I agree with everything you said. Everflowing Chalice would be beast in this deck, Acceling your DoJs and your Bonds, Plus letting you possibly even hard cast your Absorb Vis in a reasonable fashion. I would pull the Duress and the Mines, duress can just move to the side if you are really worried about control, but a faster start is going to be better. For card draw I do like the Signed in Blood, you are gaining enough life that the draw back should be minimal and you can then save your Song's for those dire situations rather then wasting them and hoping Mine with give you another.
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Alphakiller



Joined: 26 Oct 2008
Posts: 166

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ajani: play him on turn 4, gain two life.

now there are a few possibilities:

1) he absorbs at least 5 damage, effectively gaining you 7 or more(however much is overkill) life for 4 mana at sorcery speed. angel's mercy anyone?

2) they leave him alone, and he becomes worth a lot more lifegain than the mana.

3) the game goes into topdeck mode, but suddenly having an ajani in play is awesome when you draw into that otherwise useless sanguine bond.

4) your opponent can't answer the token he plays(unlikely in this format, but still worth the slot), and he smashes face for the win.

ajani fits right in with the theme of the deck as well as providing for an alternative win condition.


and about tainted sigil... I didn't really see that. i'm not too experienced with this precise card, but it seems to me that it only works to gain your own life back to nullify an attack, or to work with sanguine bond, which makes it situational. if I had noticed it in the deck i'd have told him to take it out rather than not to put it in, lol.
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heyPharaoh



Joined: 01 Nov 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 6:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alphakiller wrote:

and about tainted sigil... I didn't really see that. i'm not too experienced with this precise card, but it seems to me that it only works to gain your own life back to nullify an attack, or to work with sanguine bond, which makes it situational. if I had noticed it in the deck i'd have told him to take it out rather than not to put it in, lol.


I need some more time to think about the rest of these suggestions, thank you all for them, but I definitely wanted to quickly respond to this, and why tainted sigil equals autowin against dumb aggro decks

His life 22 My life 36 I have Sanguine out, Tainted out, and Sunspring out

Him: I swing for 16, end my turn
Me: Okay, sac Sunspring, gain 8 life, you lose 8, tap sac Tainted I gain 24 life, you lose, gg.
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Vedrfolner



Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 2325

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

heyPharaoh wrote:
Alphakiller wrote:

and about tainted sigil... I didn't really see that. i'm not too experienced with this precise card, but it seems to me that it only works to gain your own life back to nullify an attack, or to work with sanguine bond, which makes it situational. if I had noticed it in the deck i'd have told him to take it out rather than not to put it in, lol.


I need some more time to think about the rest of these suggestions, thank you all for them, but I definitely wanted to quickly respond to this, and why tainted sigil equals autowin against dumb aggro decks

His life 22 My life 36 I have Sanguine out, Tainted out, and Sunspring out

Him: I swing for 16, end my turn
Me: Okay, sac Sunspring, gain 8 life, you lose 8, tap sac Tainted I gain 24 life, you lose, gg.


Those are dumb players, not dumb decks. Both those activated abilities are of permanents in play, so if he is unaware that 16 damage would kill him, he should really learn how to play magic...

Your deck does nothing without Sanguine Bond in play, though, so you may actually have to run Diabolic Tutor or Liliana Vess in there to pull that off consistently enough.

Instead of 4 Day of Judgement, you may run 3 of them and 2 Martial Coup instead - they give you an alternative win conditon and that is good.
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Insom



Joined: 19 Dec 2008
Posts: 433

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Needz moar chalice and coup. Goldmane is just a worse version of rest for the weary for double the cost in this deck.
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heyPharaoh



Joined: 01 Nov 2009
Posts: 5

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 1:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Insom wrote:
Needz moar chalice and coup. Goldmane is just a worse version of rest for the weary for double the cost in this deck.


I agree, I ran Ajani for a couple of matches, wasnt worth the waste, at best he was a 2WW: Gain two life sorcery, at worst he was a useless draw, and yes I agree, chalice and coup need to make their way into this deck. Maybe something more like this then:

Lands 24

6 Swamp
7 Plains
4 Marsh Flats
4 Terramorphic Expanse
3 Tectonic Edge

Spells 36

1cc
4 Path to Exile
4 Sunspring Expedition

2cc
2 Sign in Blood
4 Angelsong
4 Rest for the Weary

3cc
2 Oblivion Ring
4 Tainted Sigil

4cc
3 Day of Judgment

5cc
4 Sanguine Bond

Xcc
2 Martial Coup
3 Everflowing Chalice

Any other suggestions? = / I still cant deal with UW control and similar decks, maybe build my sideboard up with answers to them? I had a land lock deck rock me last night...

@ Vedrfolner: You are correct, aggro decks aren't bad decks, its the players that play them, like someone play Jund, dropping a maelstrom pulse on my 2 howling mines instead of my two tainted signets and letting me pop off a sanguine bond and my sunspring expedition next turn.
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Alphakiller



Joined: 26 Oct 2008
Posts: 166

PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I agree, I ran Ajani for a couple of matches, wasnt worth the waste, at best he was a 2WW: Gain two life sorcery, at worst he was a useless draw, and yes I agree, chalice and coup need to make their way into this deck. Maybe something more like this then:


he goes up to 5 when you gain that 2 life. so if they barrel into him to get rid of him, you essentially gained that 5 life as well.
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