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[Concept] The Open Seas


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[PMP]FR2



Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 10:35 pm    Post subject: [Concept] The Open Seas Reply with quote

Quote:
// Lands (25)
6 [10E] Plains (3)
2 [ZEN] Marsh Flats
8 [M10] Island (2)
1 [M10] Swamp (3)
4 [M10] Glacial Fortress
4 [ZEN] Sejiri Refuge

// Creatures (Cool
2 [ZEN] Sphinx of Lost Truths
4 [CNF] Inkwell Leviathan
2 [ARB] Sphinx of the Steel Wind

// Spells (27)
4 [M10] Negate
4 [CNF] Celestial Purge
3 [ALA] Oblivion Ring
3 [LRW] Jace Beleren
1 [ALA] Protomatter Powder
4 [ZEN] Day of Judgment
4 [M10] Traumatize
4 [M10] Open the Vaults

// Sideboard (15)
SB: 4 [M10] Flashfreeze
SB: 4 [ALA] Deft Duelist
SB: 4 [CNF] Vedalken Outlander
SB: 3 [ZEN] Wall of Denial



After seeing the attempt to battle Jund in the Grixis Spreading Seas variant, I decided to conceptualize another deck based around the same enchantment. Above is what I ended up deciding on. It takes the heart of the Spreading Seas deck and incorporates it into a type of artifact reanimator deck.

Sphinx and Traumatize are your dumping outlets, and Open the Vaults is your primary reanimation outlet. Protomatter Powder can be used as a quick out should you not be able to find Open. Oblivion Ring and Day of Judgment are your options for slowing their early threats that manage to land. Day of Judgment is also needed in order to deal with the amount of CA that Jund/Elves/MGA can dish out.

Ideally, when half of your deck has hit the graveyard, thanks to Traumatize, you're then able to Open the Vaults next turn, unleashing a mass of artifacts and enchantments. You turn most of their lands into Islands, O-Ring their Planeswalkers and remaining creature threats. In addition, you should be able to bring back an unblockable Leviathan or two, and an artifact Akroma. All of which are pretty hard to deal with outside of Day of Judgment. Protomatter Powder is your outlet in the situation that your opponent plays Wrath post-Open.

Due to the amount of Aggro decks in the format, the deck may benefit from running the sided Journeys and Pacifism MD over the land denial. However, the cantrip from Spreading Seas has proven itself useful at times.

Thoughts?


Last edited by [PMP]FR2 on Thu Dec 10, 2009 1:27 am; edited 10 times in total
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Ludz
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 29 Feb 2008
Posts: 89

PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 3:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What's up with the 2 Darksteel Colossus? You know you can't reanimate them, and you have 4 Inkwell.
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loki3



Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 139

PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice concept. Seems to have potential, especially against midrange tri-color decks. How do you plan on beating RDW? As of now, this deck can't deal with the unearth guys or a barrage of beats and bolts.

Anyways... your main weakness is staying alive till you have 6 lands, with 2 of them white.

You might want to run Deft Duelists sideboard. And some instant speed removal. This may seem a bit silly, but Traps might be really good for you as sideboard, as they escape the Cascade mechanic, but can still be cheap. Pitfall Trap would probably even be good maindeck as instant speed (non-flying) creature removal. Lethargy, Mindbreak, and Whiplash can keep you alive, and Arrow Volley is more removal.

Or the 3 mana fog could go in sideboard.

Good Luck Smile
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kaamos



Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 320

PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Only 5 land enchants? what are the odds you can make enough lands colorless vs jund to disable it.
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Zapgaze
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 20 Aug 2008
Posts: 72

PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Colossus is for against mill I would guess...
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OldBear



Joined: 12 Apr 2005
Posts: 1840

PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Go upto 26 lands at least your deck wants to hit a turn 6 open the vaults every game, even with the seas and jaces you still want atleast 26 land, I would probably play 27.
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[PMP]FR2



Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So far I haven't had much trouble obtaining the two white by Turn 6, but yes, the staying alive to Turn 6 can be especially difficult against RDW because the Spreading Seas become much less efficient in the matchup.

But I believe the addition of Deft Duelist to the side would be great for that particular matchup as they run so many X/1 creatures in Hellspark, Ball Lightning, Shrine, Appeal, etc. Since Boros and RDW seem to be this deck's worse matchups, I think I might dedicate more in the SB to that matchup. Path to Exile probably need to be in the mix.

As for the land enchantments, I have 3 more Convincing Mirage in the side specifically for that matchup. However, I don't want to completely ruin my game against mono-colored Aggro by adding in the other three. That would be eight fairly useless slots against RDW and WW should I run the max. However, right now I run 9 chances to hit a Spreading Seas, plus Jace/Sphinx/Seas for draw, and then Open the Vaults will usually net you a good amount should you get to it.

The lands would be nice Trotsky, I'm just not sure what I might remove for them. Space is tight. Any suggestions?
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[PMP]FR2



Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 2:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just made a few changes to the deck, most notably the addition of Scourglass as a recurrable Obliterate on the opponent. It does cost more than Wrath, but it gets rid of their creatures and their planeswalkers, as well as coming back with OtV.

Also, the switch from Seas/Mirage to Pacifism and Crystallization because there is just too much risk of being beaten by Aggro decks without these cards. Seas/Mirage are amazing, but only in certain matchups, such as Jund and Naya. Pacifism and Crystallization are nice in almost every matchup outside of Control.

The SB is now filled with a full playset of Seas and Mirage for the aforementioned matchups, as well as Deft Duelist and Vedalken Outlander for Boros, RDW, and Naya to an extent.
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Karmoth



Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

doesnt this deck loose to any deck that plays a counter fo open the vaults?
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CrushU
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well those were sucky draws...
Played against a monoblack Vamp, and drew nothing but SotSW, Inkwell, and Traumatize. For two games in a row.

And then he claimed that obviously the deck sucked. So I reshuffled and dealt out a hand, showing solitaire game... and I had four islands and only white cards, and four turns later, six islands, no white mana, only white spells. Absolutely silly.

On the other hand, I've played this against Jund, Boros, and RDW... it works reliably against Jund, and utterly stomps RDW after sideboard. Boros walks over it, as far as I've seen. It's surprising how often I get T5 Traumatize into T6 Open...

Thought Hemmorage immediately shuts the deck down. As Karmoth mentioned, take out Open the Vaults and you're left with a bunch of junk.
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[PMP]FR2



Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Sun Dec 06, 2009 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CrushU wrote:
Well those were sucky draws...
Played against a monoblack Vamp, and drew nothing but SotSW, Inkwell, and Traumatize. For two games in a row.

And then he claimed that obviously the deck sucked. So I reshuffled and dealt out a hand, showing solitaire game... and I had four islands and only white cards, and four turns later, six islands, no white mana, only white spells. Absolutely silly.

On the other hand, I've played this against Jund, Boros, and RDW... it works reliably against Jund, and utterly stomps RDW after sideboard. Boros walks over it, as far as I've seen. It's surprising how often I get T5 Traumatize into T6 Open...

Thought Hemmorage immediately shuts the deck down. As Karmoth mentioned, take out Open the Vaults and you're left with a bunch of junk.



Seems you got a severe case of mana screw in those first few games. Haven't been stuck with anything like that thus far in my testing. *Knocks on wood* I believe proper mulliganing is essential to this deck, as it's almost like a combo deck. You usually look for utility spells and a Traumatize/Sphinx or OtV in your opening hand. At least, that's what I've been doing.

Vamps are definitely going to be a tough matchup, as no SB room has been dedicated to that matchup. Not as much of a surge of Vamps, so I thought it better to go after Jund/Boros/RDW. You mind me asking your sideboard plan against RDW? Seems like you've had some more success there than me. Maybe I can find some more room in the board for the worse matchups, if we smash RDW post-Board.

I think we might need to include a few more Powder in the SB to compensate for the post-board Thought Hemmorage. Didn't know it was being played by that many decks, but I see how it could be detrimental in the Jund matchup.

Thanks for the time and effort Crush and being able to point out a few of the flaws in the deck. Extra testing is always appreciated. I'm continually working on it, but this is exam week for me so I've been a little hindered as far as time goes. I believe there's a definite contender under there, it just needs some good polishing.
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CrushU
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 12:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SB vs RDW: -3 Scourglass, -3 Crystallization, -1 Pacifism, +4 Duelist, +3 Outlander

IIRC. Reason is that Crys/Pacifism do absolutely nothing to RDW, except maybe stop a pede/guide, which you can do better with Outlander anyway.

Observation: I seem to not get any great effect off of Ardent Plea's. The cascade is sorta nice as it lets you hit the 2drops reliably... But it also makes it hard for me to run Negate, which is the natural answer for Hemorrhage and other OtV killers. I also tweaked a bit and took out Scourglass for O-Rings, as I noticed that I kinda preferred to be able to kill an artifact once in a while, and killing Planeswalkers quickly was nice, as well as a bit of spot removal in a pinch.

I was also having problems finding any time I'd prefer Crystallization/Pacifism in the deck over Mirage or Duelist. I also noticed that C-Purge is a bit better at dealing with RDW than Crys/Pacifism, and also helps against Vamps and Jund too. I'm tweaking and when I get a stable build I'll post it.
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[PMP]FR2



Joined: 03 Dec 2009
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds very good. Can't see why I passed over Purge, but it seems like a great card right now. Helps in almost all relevant matchups. Can't wait to see the list. I think I'm going to change back to the O-Rings as well. I was just experimenting with Scourglass, but it doesn't seem like it's worked out well for either one of us.

And perhaps Flashfreeze would work better MD than Negate? Vamps don't seem to have that many non-creature spells that are threatening.
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Karmoth



Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Posts: 6

PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 5:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i d play negate in the sideboard and board the pleas out for the negates when you need them!
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CrushU
Level 1 Judge


Joined: 31 Aug 2004
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Mon Dec 07, 2009 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Negate > Flashfreeze, for this purpose.

Flashfreeze won't give us anything vs UW Control, we have DoJ to deal with creatures.

Vamps have Eldrazi Monument. Sometimes. And Mind Sludge, is the main card I'd want to Negate in that matchup.
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