Help me brainstorm a casual extended Gifts-Wrath strategy

Thicket · Joined: 18 Mar 2006 Posts: 80

Hello! As my card knowledge isn't spectacular, I'm looking for some brain-storming assistance or suggestions on how to make a certain strategy I've been kicking around for a casual extended deck work. My opponents are mainly zoo, bant, faeries, and doran so I don't, for now, care about stopping dredge or hyperG etc.

The main idea is 2 fold really:

1. Keep most creatures (aside from accelerants or utility guys) in hand, survive till I can play a wrath effect, leaving them with an empty board and hoping for new creatures off the top, me with an empty board with a hand well stocked (goyfs, baneslayers, etc) to take control post-wrath.

2. Gifts Ungiven, which since there are essentially 2 white wraths now, either lets me play the above strat or, if they eliminate wrath and day, give me 2 other helpful cards possibly including eternal witness which could get me my wrath afterall.

Im inexperienced playing a gifts deck but really want to make one work. Im thinking this deck would be best as white green with blue splashed for gifts (and maybe meddling mage and/or ponder?)

Here are the card choices I've been thinking about. Please don't blast me too hard as im admitting I have little experience with gifts builds so if im way off base, please let me know but keep it civil.

White:

Wrath and day of judgment. I doubt I need 4 of each, but I def want to draw one, even if I don't manage a gifts. 3 of each or 4 of one, two of the other?

Post-wrath killaz- I def want Baneslayer as one of my post-wrath drops. Im thinking 3? 1 or 2 yosei, the morning star also seems like an appropriate creature here, saw it in a recent gifts build that did well in an M-L tourn. Any other good white semi-win condition creatures that can be gifted or held in hand for after the dust settles, so to speak? I'm thinking an elspeth or 2 could be helpful as well?

4 path to exile- a zoo player at heart, I can't conceive of playing a white deck without 4 of these unless it just destroys the core, which here I don't believe it does. Love this card.

Green:

Noble hierarch- speed up wraths and gifts, blah blah. Not much explanation needed

Eternal witness- seems like a good card to gift up, allowing me access to something I've been denied.

Goyf- umm, yeah.

Post-wrath drops: im not sure here really. Maybe the new rampaging baloth guy here? That way while we both topdeck in a late-game, even pulling land helps further advance my strategy. Or should this department be left soley to white? Or lean more on blue? I was thinking knights of the reliquary since my manabase may involve fetches (tho I haven't thought too much about mana base yet so maybe not). I figure there have got to be some appropriate green guys for this role, hence this post in the first place. What do ya'll think?

Blue:

Gifts, of course. But what else blue could help here? Unless there's a really nice blue semi-fatty flier I don't know of, it seems like outside of gifts blue is my least important color. Meddling mage seems helpful to make the game plan run more smoothly. Ponder could help too, but might be a waste of space. Mana Leak is nice but might be taking away slots from stuff that makes my game plan work better. For now I'm thinking to not include any.

This is where I need the help. There might be a must-include blue card here I just don't know about. Assuming the strategy itself is sound, anything helpful here?

Creature enhancers: jitte, sword of x and y, armadillo cloak. I figure 4-6 (total combined) of these should be included to help beef up the post-wrath squad, but I don't want to use up too much space when the creatures themselves are likely more important.

Sideboard: im thinking stuff like canonist, pridemage, cop: r, stifle for fetch-heavy manabases, even worship could be good post wrath. Just thinking out loud. I'll tighten this up once any responses here help define the main deck better.

So that's my general idea. Im not asking anyone to build a whole deck for me, id like to ultimately do that. I just figure there are some really good cards for a strat like this that I just don't know about, or possibly other gifts and/or wrath tactics im not privy to that I should be aware of. I've looked at some other gifts decks, but they're either very old or working a very different strategy with different colors.

What do you guys think? Remember, this is for casual. I do want it to be strong, but it doesn't have to break extended or anything (obviously) lol Thanks!

jonproject · Joined: 22 Dec 2007 Posts: 250

Stifle rotated, consider some of the other lists that have been doing well. Check out deckcheck.net for some ideas on what a Gifts deck is looking for. I'd recommend Sakura Tribe-Elder over Noble Heirarch, STE plays better with wrath effects. I would recommend Engineered Explosives, as well.

Thicket · Joined: 18 Mar 2006 Posts: 80

OK, the STE definitely makes sense. As far as checking other Gifts decks, I'm definitely going to do that, though it seems that gifts can work well with so many strategies, I'm actually more interested to see how other wrath decks are operating. Also, wouldnt EE be too limiting of a sweeper? I'm def not discounting it as a good card, but wouldnt wraths be a better board clearer? Unless cost is the only concern, then I can see the point.

JonP, what creatures come to mind, green white or blue, for a wrath 'n' rebuild strategy? Im def sold on baneslayer, and the Baloths feels like a smart idea in theory. Anything else I may not be aware of that suggests itself?

Thanks for the help!

jonproject · Joined: 22 Dec 2007 Posts: 250

Explosives is good if you aren't playing counterspells, it will deal with creatures and 3cc or less permanents (Jitte comes to mind, Bitterblossom is being played SB in Dark Depths). As for UWG finishers, Yosei is good. Meloku is powerful and will win games unanswered.

As for Gifts packages, I like Resurrection as a singleton; you can fetch up a fatty package (i.e. Tarmogoyf, Yosei, Meloku, Resurrection). This forces them to bin the Resurrection (paying four mana for a fattie is better than five or six) and Yosei or Meloku depending. Worm Harvest is a decent singleton as well; you WILL use it if you Gifts for it. Basically, you want to play singletons that make your Gifts Ungiven get you more value than the two cards you get in hand, if you catch my drift.

Bear in mind that I am in no way an extended expert or even anything but a noob. I've been reading about it and testing a lot and enjoy it, but I'm still lacking in knowledge about the Extended card pool. I also am not sure a wrath-based control deck does well in Extended at the moment. In the metagame you plan on playing it in, I could see it thriving, though. Good luck!

Thicket · Joined: 18 Mar 2006 Posts: 80

Bro that was way helpful, thanks! And yeah I get ripped on on here sometimes for my ideas, but usually fail to mention that my metagame is a small group of people and I dont do much in the way of tourneys, so for better or worse, some strategies that will die to 25% of an extended PTQ would actually be very effective vs my brother and friends. We're good players(I think), but we don't really go out and play a ton of people. But I'd still rather build something generally pretty good than simply hose a single opponent I play most often, you know? I just don't give a shit about Tormod's Crypt when Dredge isn't even something I ever see.

sirkozi · Joined: 24 Oct 2006 Posts: 19

Casual deck with Goyfs, Hierarchs, Wogs and Jittes? Oo

Spyx · Joined: 31 Oct 2004 Posts: 1009

You could also run 1 hallowed burial. Since gifts costs 4 you can always drop it the turn after anyway, and it gets rid of marit lage.too Wink

Thicket · Joined: 18 Mar 2006 Posts: 80

I put the deck together last night and played some vs my brother's Bant deck. It was great!

JonProject I DEFINITELY included the Resurrection, that was an awesome idea. I didn't go with Worm Harvest. I did put a single Explosives in as well. Lemme see if I can remember the list off the top of my head, I'm at work currently:

4 Gifts
4 Sakura
3 Wrath
3 Day of Judgment
4 Goyf
4 Baneslayer
4 Rampaging Baloths (say what you will about this card, but it is AMAZING for this deck, I'll explain below)

(some of the 1-ofs are sideboard, i dont remember whats in and whats out atm so ill lump them together as I recall them)
1 Ressurection
1 Meloku
1 EE
1 Path
1 Yosei
1 Eternal Witness
1 Ajani Goldmane
1 Loxodon Heirarch
1 Knight of the Relequary
3 Qasali(SB)
4 Canonist(SB)
2 Worship (SB)
1+ COP:R

I'm sure Im missing others, just going from quick memory. Mana base was basically 3 Plains, 2 Forests, 1 Island, 1 Breeding Pool, 4 Temple Garden, 4 Hallowed Fountain, 4 Misty RF, 3 Arid Mesa, 3 Marsh Flats

The Baloths really worked well in this deck, I must say! First off, when the game goes into late game topdeck mode, it's nice to know that when the opponent draws a 10th land and is pissed to not get a business spell, at worst I'm picking up a new 4/4. Also it has a really nice synergy with meloku! (edit: and knights of the rel)

My main concern with the deck is countermagic and disruption, but that's pretty much a weakness to any deck, so it doesnt feel much more serious than for other decks, other than that it has to wait to really make its move. Hallowed Burial is an interesting idea, Spyx, only because my brother's Bant is running 4 Meddling Mages, so it's basically a 3rd Wrath Smile

Knight of Reliquary was an early consideration I said "nahh" to at 1st, till my 1st game when I realized later on that if I had one, it would've been like 8/8 with all the fetching. Then I ran and grabbed one.

I have lots of other thoughts about it, and am DEF still down for suggestions! But I need to get back to work, so I'll spare you more rambling.

PS: Ruling question.. can you bant charm a token creature? You cant put it on the bottom of a library (what if I'm using a blueberry muffin as my token?), but it also doesn';t say anything about being "destroyed." Seems like a weird grey area, but as it's written, seems like my 4/4 beasts should be immune (not that they're the ideal targets anyway, but it did come up).

Thanks!

Thicket · Joined: 18 Mar 2006 Posts: 80

Maybe also 1 Mirror Entity and 1 Weird Harvest?

jonproject · Joined: 22 Dec 2007 Posts: 250

You can bant charm a token, it will cease to exist though, so it basically just destroys the token. I like the list, though it could probably use some amount of Bant Charm, it gives you spot removal and permission. I'm not sure about the Ajani Goldmane, though. I think it could easily be an Elspeth, Knight-Errant. You could probably make use of some amount of cheap counterspells, too. I would recommend Condescend, Mana Leak, and/or Remand.

Thicket · Joined: 18 Mar 2006 Posts: 80

Ha! We are so on the same page! I thought about all of those things, although the Ajani was an all star in one of my games last night. Possibly an isolated incident, but tough to let em go. Though I do like Elspeth a lot. Bant Charm is a good though too.

I was thinkin about some counters too. Leak and condescend come to mind. Just hard to know what I can get rid of. Especially now thinking Mirror Entity could be a straight up bomb in this deck as well. Hmmm.

Realized weird harvest, which i was thinking about, wouldnt be good. Yeah fills my hand up with fatties, but while i put out an angel, they get to put out 4 goyfs or whatever. not good.

Great suggestions and glad you dig the deck. Im lovin it myself so far Smile