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Cruel 'n' Toast Standard


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yokai



Joined: 08 Nov 2008
Posts: 77

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 7:40 pm    Post subject: Cruel 'n' Toast Standard Reply with quote

// Lands
1 [SHM] Mystic Gate
1 [10E] Adarkar Wastes
1 [EVE] Cascade Bluffs
3 [EVE] Flooded Grove
4 [SHM] Reflecting Pool
2 [SHM] Sunken Ruins
4 [LRW] Vivid Grove
4 [LRW] Vivid Creek
1 [SHM] Fire-Lit Thicket
4 [LRW] Vivid Meadow

// Creatures
2 [LRW] Cloudthresher > fae , bitter's and possetions
4 [LRW] Mulldrifter > auto-explicative
2 [LRW] Shriekmaw > i think it better then terror , it comes back with cruel ultimatum and can be bounced for command.
1 [LRW] Liliana Vess > MACHINE against contrrol
2 [ALA] Broodmate Dragon/1 brood and 1 oona
3 [CFX] Wall of Reverence > it's sorcery speed , but I prefer this then plumoveil

// Spells
2 [SHM] Firespout > auto-explicateve
4 [LRW] Cryptic Command > auto-explicative
2 [ALA] Bant Charm > counter and condemn , very good
2 [10E] Wrath of God > auto-explicative
4 [ALA] Esper Charm > bye bye bitter's , draw and discard in instant speed
2 [ALA] Cruel Ultimatum > auto-explicative
2 [10E] Condemn > perfect spot removal
1 [10E] Tidings > perfect draw in late game
1 [10E] Pyroclasm > auto explicative
1 [CFX] Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker > OWNER
1 [CFX] Volcanic Fallout > bye bye fae

// Sideboard
SB: 1 [LRW] Cloudthresher > fae , bitter's and possetions
SB: 1 [LRW] Liliana Vess > MACHINE against contrrol
SB: 2 [10E] Condemn > perfect spot removal
SB: 1 [CFX] Volcanic Fallout > bye bye fae
SB: 2 [LRW] Wispmare > bitter? where?
SB: 1 [ALA] Empyrial Archangel > aggro decks? where?
SB: 2 [MOR] Mind Shatter > mirror/other controls
SB: 2 [EVE] Glen Elendra Archmage > mirror/other controls
SB: 3 [10E] Pithing Needle > fucking RW lark(ajani , sierge gang , mogg , mutavault , fulminator...)

what do u think about this deck?
conflux is a very good gard , but 1 cant find a slot 4 it =/
the same 4 Maelstrom Archangel
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gypsy



Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1671

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 8:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jace is better than mulldrifter, path to exile is better than most of your removal, you should be playing your own ajanis, bant charm is overrated, plumveil is better than wall 100% of the time, you should be playing broken ambitions and im pretty sure u dont need 2 cruels and a nicol bolas
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Spyx



Joined: 31 Oct 2004
Posts: 1188

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mind Spring > Tidings?
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Ggerg



Joined: 04 Sep 2005
Posts: 632

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

child of alara, and/or ajani vengeant please
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R3wind



Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1386

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 9:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Umm yeah Path to Exile is so much better then Condemn. The only reason to play Condenm is you can only play 4 Path to Exile.

Control decks need at least 4 spot removal spells in the main or side.

You also need at least one of Glen Elendra Archmage and Ethersworn Adjudicator. Both cards are pure card advantage if you get them online. Speaking of that Jace is a lot better then Mulldrifter. I run Mulldrifters for very late game beatings.
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Super_Prep



Joined: 04 Feb 2009
Posts: 104

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 9:41 pm    Post subject: Try this out Reply with quote

// Lands
1 [SHM] Mystic Gate
1 [10E] Adarkar Wastes
1 [EVE] Cascade Bluffs
1 Underground River
2 [EVE] Flooded Grove
4 [SHM] Reflecting Pool
2 [SHM] Sunken Ruins
4 [LRW] Vivid Grove
4 [LRW] Vivid Creek
1 [SHM] Fire-Lit Thicket
4 [LRW] Vivid Meadow

// Creatures
2 [LRW] Cloudthresher > fae , bitter's and possetions
4 [LRW] Mulldrifter > auto-explicative
2 [LRW] Shriekmaw > i think it better then terror , it comes back with cruel ultimatum and can be bounced for command.
2 Ajani Vengant
1 [ALA] Broodmate Dragon
1 Onna Queen of the Fae
2 Plumenviel - hes just a better card, he does'nt sit and die like wall does.

// Spells
2 [SHM] Firespout > auto-explicateve
4 [LRW] Cryptic Command > auto-explicative
3 [10E] Wrath of God > auto-explicative
3 [ALA] Esper Charm > bye bye bitter's , draw and discard in instant speed
2 [ALA] Cruel Ultimatum > auto-explicative
4 Path to Exile
1 [CFX] Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker > OWNER
2 [CFX] Volcanic Fallout > bye bye fae

// Sideboard
SB: 1 [LRW] Cloudthresher > fae , bitter's and possetions
Sb: 4 Story Circle
SB: 1 [CFX] Volcanic Fallout > bye bye fae
SB: 2 [LRW] Wispmare > bitter? where?
SB: 2 [MOR] Mind Shatter > mirror/other controls
SB: 2 [EVE] Glen Elendra Archmage > mirror/other controls
SB: 3 [10E] Pithing Needle > fucking RW lark(ajani , sierge gang , mogg , mutavault , fulminator...)
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Alvaro21k



Joined: 28 Dec 2004
Posts: 78

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In this deck, Id value condemn much more than path to exile, sometimes you just need to condemn that turn 1 figure, but if you PTE it, things can get out of control with some unwanted siege-gangs, rangers or larks.
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R3wind



Joined: 24 Jul 2006
Posts: 1386

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You really do not need Wispmare if you have maindeck Esper Charm. I really think that is a wasted slot. I would change that out for one Ethersworn Adjudicator and one Loxodon Warhammer.

Okie the rest of the sideboard is kind of a big mess inho.

Mind Shatter should be Scepter of Fugue.

Story Circle gets stoped by Torment and Pithing Needle by RDW. I would cut one for sure. Wickerbrough Elder would be a great one of in the side.

I also think that you should ether run Fallout or Sprout not both. It's really a meta call. Cut one of the Cruel for the Cloudthresher from the side. That let's you run Sprout in the main and still be safe.

Know for the last slot. You need a Relic of Pro to help hate out Cruise and Unearth.

Also be sure to side in Needles vs Unearth as it may be the only way to win the match. That deck is so fast.

So the new side should be.

3 Pithing Needle
3 Story Circle
2 Scepter of Fugue
2 Glen Elendra Archmage
2 Wickerbrough Elder
1 Loxodon Warhammer
1 Ethersworn Adjudicator
1 Relic of Progenitus or Primal Command

If I was to run a greedy control deck like Cruel Control then, I would have to make sure that I had at least one card to help EVERY matchup.

It's my belief that the meta is going to speed up over the next weeks.
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alsorhombus



Joined: 26 Oct 2008
Posts: 58

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gypsy wrote:
jace is better than mulldrifter, path to exile is better than most of your removal, you should be playing your own ajanis, bant charm is overrated, plumveil is better than wall 100% of the time, you should be playing broken ambitions and im pretty sure u dont need 2 cruels and a nicol bolas


What?

Jace is good. He doesn't replace 4x mulldrifter in any 5c control

I dont like bant charm either, I'd rather have more volcanic fallouts.

Path to exile is good. Its ok to give them land, just entices them to overextend into a wrath.
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gypsy



Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1671

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

trust me play with jace and youll realize how much better it is then drifter, drifter doesnt do anything, its worse than your other 3 drops, and it doesnt trade with anything anymore
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Vedrfolner



Joined: 04 Apr 2006
Posts: 2325

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you don't play Makeshift Mannequin, there really isn't any point to playing Mulldrifter over Jace. With 2-3 Mannequin in there, though, it is pointless playing Jace.
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gypsy



Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1671

PostPosted: Sat Feb 07, 2009 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

theres no reason to play mannequin in the first place
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Ggerg



Joined: 04 Sep 2005
Posts: 632

PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 1:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jace vs. drifter really just depends on how you plan to deal with each other matchup (mostly RW and the mirror). jace is pretty bad vs RW (doesn't usually net you 2 cards), but is obviously waaaaay better vs other 5cc.

if you expect your deck to be able to win by only netting one card off of jace vs RW, then play jace for sure. tuning your sb to let this happen is probably your best bet.


for those of you saying path to exile is better than condemn here, i'm not disagreeing with you, but i'd like to hear some likely examples of situations where path is better. (to the guy who said "having more lands entices them to overextend," please realize that if they are bad at magic, you'll win anyway. prepare for the good players, not the bad ones)

what do you think of child of alara
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rentintin3



Joined: 11 Dec 2008
Posts: 73

PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 5:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

child is not good. you will either have him in play after a wrath or in play while they have dudes before a wrath. So if you already wrathed I would rather have a dragon. If you didn't wrath then they will just try to race it I think...

I was just use Boat vs 5cc as the exapmle.

Oh yeah a drifter is good no matter what. One at some point you have to kill you opp and shocking them for 2 does help. Another he is a good Cruel target. Plus like someone said jace is only good in mirror and against fae if you drop it on turn 3 and they don't play any goods cards in there deck!
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gypsy



Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 1671

PostPosted: Sun Feb 08, 2009 5:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jace is better vs everything because you have so much removal you dont need to worry about it dying
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