Horde of Notions

FusionFire · Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 246

Horde of Notions WUBRG
Vigilance, trample, haste
5/5
WUBRG: You may play target Elemental card from your graveyard without paying its mana cost.

ok, now unless i'm mistaken that means i can pay the cost and "play" target Elemental card (lets use mulldrifter as an example)
because of the way its worded, that means that what ever card I "target" still can only be played under the normal casting rules right? (ie i cant do that EOT with a mulldrifter)....right?

Second question is if I target muldrifter, can i claim i'm "paying" the evoke cost so it comes into play, triggers the ability and then goes back into the GY?

Thanks!!

Coonan · Joined: 31 Dec 2008 Posts: 2

1) *wrong, edited by CMA-Flippi

2) No, you can't.

gypsy · Joined: 15 Jun 2007 Posts: 1271

connan is wrong on the first part. you can play creatures eot with it

SniperMayer · Joined: 31 Jan 2008 Posts: 269

The ability helps you play the drifter which is instant. The fact that drifter is a creature doesn't count. You can do it EOT unless the ability is countered.

EDIT: This is just like Makeshift Mannequin. The same happens. The only thing is that Horde makes the same thing from his ability and you don't have to waste a card for this. Smile

Dr_Moo · Joined: 26 Nov 2004 Posts: 1013

hawt is correct.

Read the card, people.
"You may play target Elemental..."

You can only play creature spells during your main phase when the stack is empty. This is always true, regardless of how you are playing the spell.

Unless you know the answer, you shouldn't be posting.

DARKING · Joined: 13 Jun 2006 Posts: 76

1.- You may play the creature card when Horde of Notions ability resolves. Since you can play the Notions ability any time you could play an instant, you can play a mulldrifter at eot. The same is true for cards with similar wordings, like the Hideaway lands and Guile.
All this abilities ask you wheter to play the card on resolution. If you say yes, you play it at that moment. If you say no, the card will remain where it is, and cannot play it again this way unless you play the ability again.

2.- No, you can't evoke mulldfifter this way. The mulldrifter will be played as usual, not with evoke mode on.

Blancoke · Joined: 06 Aug 2006 Posts: 12

Hardtrack · Joined: 10 Aug 2005 Posts: 506

And, in case there was still any doubt:

Horde of Notions.

1) You play the creature while the activated ability is resolving. Normally you couldn't play anything then, not even instants, so 'normal timing' goes out the window (just like Hideaway lands, as has been pointed out). Any time you can play the activated ability, you can play the creature spell.

This is because the rules are permissive, not prohibitive. They don't say 'you can't play creatures unless it's your main phase, the stack is empty and you have priority' thereby outruling all other times. They just say 'you can play creatures...'. So if something else comes along and creates a new time at which to play creatures, the rules are fine with it. In this case, Horde of Notions creates such a time, when its ability is resolving. Spells don't have 'timing restrictions' unless they give them to themselves, like Master Warcraft.

So, in conclusion, you can play the creature whenever you can play the ability, like an instant.

2) You are already using an alternative way of playing it, you can't use two alternative ways of playing something at the same time.

And, once again, try to be polite when you're correcting people, especially when you're wrong (i.e. not 100% sure about the answer).

DARKING · Joined: 13 Jun 2006 Posts: 76

One way to know if a card tells you to play it right at that moment, or if only you can play it at its usual speed, is by looking at the text. Cards that only let you play it at its normal speed normally give you a longer duration to do so and not tell you to play them right away, example is Spelljack or Knacksaw Clique. These cards gave you a longer duration to play them (in this case, the whole game and the current turn, respectively) and thus its cards can only be played at the usual speed.

mTk-Away · Joined: 02 Apr 2005 Posts: 86

Think of suspend. If it wouldn't be possible for a spell or ability to break the "timing rules", suspend would be a dead horse.

In other words: Horde's playing (or not playing, if you choose so, as it's "may") happens at the time the activated ability resolves.

FreshVeggies · Joined: 21 Dec 2008 Posts: 19

I'm suprised we had to debate this

JeZeus · Joined: 05 Sep 2004 Posts: 129

Well if you have ever played with Horde of Notions, you wouldn't be surprised at how often this 'has' to be debated in game. It get's even more confusing when you are using cards such as nameless inversion or crib swap instead of your standard 'elemental' cards.

xiko · Joined: 28 Sep 2004 Posts: 23

the simple answer of why you can´t evoke using the ability is because you can only evoke something from your hand Wink

FusionFire · Joined: 18 Jan 2006 Posts: 246

So now that Horde of Notions has a very viable ability, lets use it:

// Deck file for Magic Workstation

// Lands
1 Graven Cairns
3 Vivid Marsh
1 Battlefield Forge
4 Reflecting Pool
2 Vivid Meadow
3 Vivid Grove
3 Sunken Ruins
1 Mystic Gate
3 Flooded Grove
4 Vivid Creek

// Creatures
2 Cloudthresher
4 Mulldrifter
3 Plumeveil
4 Kitchen Finks
1 Horde of Notions

// Spells
3 Condemn
3 Negate
2 Cruel Ultimatum
4 Esper Charm
2 Jund Charm
4 Cryptic Command
3 Wrath of God

// Sideboard
SB: 1 Condemn
SB: 2 Shriekmaw
SB: 1 Jace Beleren
SB: 1 Wispmare
SB: 1 Mind Shatter
SB: 4 Vexing Shusher
SB: 3 Ajani Vengeant
SB: 2 Tempest of Light

I have played this version a few times and Horde of Notions is amazing for EOT Cloudthreshers and Mulldrifters. As well as dodging the usual Shriekmaw and terror effects.

Clariax · Joined: 16 Jan 2006 Posts: 56

This is not correct. If the Mulldrifter were being played from teh library (due to Future Sight) or graveyard (due to Yawgmoth's Will), for examples, it could still be evoked. It cannot be evoked when played via Horde of Notions because Evoke involved paying an alternate cost.

When playing something via an alternate cost, you pay that alternate cost instead of the mana cost. Horde of Notions has you play it without paying the mana cost, however. Since you're already replacing paying the mana cost with paying nothing, you cannot replace it again with paying the evoke cost.