by dschidi on 2017-08-03 00:14 CET
Thank you for bringing some action to the table. Im not sure about the donating plan yet. I like the idea though. But for me my first thought was: Its not that hard to win a trial for a bye and i dont really want to spend money for another one, since one of the best things about the magic-league masters is that they are for free.
Maybe it would be more "fair" when all pay the same "small" fee. But then it will be harder to get players... hmmm. Would like to hear what other players think about this.
by Censored on 2017-08-03 03:53 CET
nice to finally see some action here, any attempt at moving forward is good
personally i think that currently there are too many "trials", some firing with only 4 people, and giving byes to a master with such few numbers is wrong
have the trials sure, but let them only count for a bye to a master if there is at least 9 players.
i also think the trials should be changed to swiss format (Without top 8 cut), as single elimination is just a bit meh
as for the master, i think any master with prizes coming from donation is sending entirely the wrong message to the community, and is really not going to entice new people into joining us.
the biggest appeal of ML has been the free to enter tournament play, both for practice, and a bit of competition online for people who dont have the time to commit to grinding on modo, or dont have the funds to do so.
also asking people to donate for the prize funds also sends the wrong message that moving forward this site does not have the financial backing that it needs to become a big player within the magic community.
sure there are some people who will donate some cash for prize winnings, but after they dont win a few times they will think why bother?
there are enough people on here who will play without a cash prize, and some people (i know at least myself) havent even recieved their winnings anyway.
i think the idea of charging people a small fee to play will reduce the chances of getting new people who think "hey, what the hell lets try it" when they see there is a fee involved, not to mention the amount of extra work someone is going to have to do to include credit card/paypal payments to the website.
i mean you could try doing 8-man only swiss tournaments with an entry fee, where winner takes 50% of the prize money, 2nd takes 25% and the site takes 25% and see where it goes but im not convinced you are going to get many takers for it
as for formats, while keeping it varied makes it fun, it also reduces the chance of setting up our own meta. if there was going to be some schedule then i think its important to have consistant and regular main formats, and then working around them, add mini tournaments for other formats only. master tournaments should be limited to standard mainly, followed by modern and then to a lesser extent legacy. with trials to the tournament being the same format as the master the trials lead to.
the master could be once a month, with 2 trials per week, winner recieving a bye for that next master.
between each master there should be a "temporary" ratings ladder for the stipulated master tournament that counts all ranked games played of that format between masters (as well as counting for the normal formats) to give the best active players during that period byes as well to that master.
there are too many people that dont play on a regular basis that have high rating on the ladder and only play in masters, and remain highly rankewd because they do quite well.
they dont support the site with their activity but get byes anyway.
since teams rankings are also currently an indicator of player activity, top ranked team players should also get a bye
and byes should stack, up to maximum of 3 to again encourage people to play and win trials or be active enough to get to the top rankings in the temporary ladder to have a head start so to speak in the master
by dschidi on 2017-08-03 12:26 CET
1st: Are we talking about only ONE (the next) Master? Or for several (until Jaden do some action)?
2nd: The top Team already gets a bye for Masters (Players with at least 100 Teampoints) @censored
3rd: My feeling is that Modern is the most liked format on ml. As it is for me too. I can see Modern/Standard/Limited Masters but all other formats probably dont pull enough players. Im fine with "smaller" formats being Trials, also with them being single elimination. My guess is that one of the goals of Jaden is to include a swiss tournaments feature at the site anyway. So maybe in the future we will have swiss trials. But i can see them not being liked, because when several Players finish it with the same amount of points and only the the 1st place wins (because of tie breakers and opp score) it would be very frustating for the other players when they end up 2nd or worse with the same amount of wins
by moscowdemon on 2017-08-03 14:19 CET
1. It would only be for a few masters, as currently Jaden is working on things like our server move and other big, good things for the site. :) I just realized we have this gap of time where we won't have masters set up and I wanted to still offer them. This would by no means be permanent, but maybe at most for a few masters while I let him get situated as owner. He has many things to work on and I want him to catch himself up to speed and prepare for the long road ahead first. :)
2. For now, due to sizes of the masters lately, it wouldn't be a good idea to give out more than one bye to a person (with a strict limit on two if we came to it). If we give up to three byes in a 20 person field, you pretty much are locked for top 8 right away and that's both boring and not fun at all to everyone else.
3. From the responses so far, modern is by far the favorite type of choice, but this doesn't mean we will solely do modern events. I do want to spread it out, I just want to cater to the players main wants more.
Also, for sawiss events, it requires someone with special admin permissions to upload those events after. So as of now, swiss events need to stay limited. For the rest of your ideas about trials, how often, etc, those are all things I have already been considering (such as weekend only trials). There is a bunch I am going to try to look into to make the players and events better off.
by GreenBear on 2017-08-03 23:23 CET
by GreenBear on 2017-08-03 23:26 CET
by Sebas_ on 2017-08-04 04:56 CET
I see a way to go, im totally into paying an small fee with money prizes, i.e. 1 dollar per 8 man swiss, magic-league takes 1 usd's for paying site related stuff, winner takes 5 usd's 2nd place takes 2 usd's.
Basically just like pokerstars does
by GaryOak on 2017-08-04 18:08 CET
by andrw1232 on 2017-08-10 22:09 CET
First off, it feels absolutly wrong to charge an abmission to ML tournaments for so many reasons. I know that I for one play on ML because I dont have the funds for MTGO, (not that I would leave ML even if i did) and I think its probably the same for many others. The whole hassle of a small entry fee really turns me off.
I agree that swiss trials are a bad idea for reasons stated above.
I liked the donated master idea but people raised really good points and after thinking about it I have to hop in the boat of it being a bad idea. The buy a "bye" thing seems really money hungry and pay to win which I dont like.
My best times for trials are anytime after 4:00 MDT as that's when I home from school.
by brianhri on 2017-08-18 01:39 CET
I think before selling Byes, ML should look to fit in with normal F2P models. (this is obviously coming from my zero coding knowledge etc.) You could have people donate to have a specific color name on the website, or to get a tag in cockatrice. You could offer for people to donate X amount of dollars to pick the next trial format. I think offering these silly, non-essential donation rewards is better than offering byes.
Another thing that could be an option would be to sell entries to win a gift card such as amazon or something. (I know raffles get iffy with different country/state laws so this idea is probably a terrible one.)